BBFS Poll... No names!
- Thread starter mr. x
- Start date
Hmmm, I'm still inclined to believe that BBFS is something that is "requested" by the Client, not necessarily something "offered" by the Provider. My Pop always said "You pay the cost to be the boss" and I hold that to be true especially in this case. So the poll looks to be weighted to the SP's shoulders as opposed to "How many of us Clients have requested it". "How much cash did you flash for it?" and other questions that puts the onus on the shoulders of the ones requesting, pressuring, accepting and paying for the service.mr. x said:
Just an observation...but I have never been offered it by a Provider.
Re: Re: BBFS Poll... No names!
IMO, and I'm sure many others , this behavior is utterly reprehensible. This hobby is dangerous enough when everything is done safely, and yet some individuals seem to have no qualms about it whatsoever.
To engage in bbfs with an SP, no matter how well you think you know her is a monument to idiocy. Think about that the next time you're waiting for your AIDS test results.
Either way, assuming that the responses to the poll are accurate, bbfs is taking place.spartan5782 said:
IMO, and I'm sure many others , this behavior is utterly reprehensible. This hobby is dangerous enough when everything is done safely, and yet some individuals seem to have no qualms about it whatsoever.
To engage in bbfs with an SP, no matter how well you think you know her is a monument to idiocy. Think about that the next time you're waiting for your AIDS test results.
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S
sara@select
Cathy, probably not the best idea! This would cause many a client to wave a paper around saying- "i'm safe therefore....." and we all know the rest! The fact is anyone and everyone participating in the hobby should be tested regularly- it's called being a responsible adult (as well as being responsible for your own health) Now, while you know you are safe you never know if someone else is- so please err on the side of caution and don't be a fool! Cover up Mr. Happy, when he's still going strong 20 years from now you'll be glad you did!
Re: Re: Re: BBFS Poll... No names!
I’ve been doing a little informal survey of my own. I’ve asked several SPs whom I’ve seen recently if BBFS was ever requested by the client. One girl told me she gets asked 1 out of 3 bookings, which is really scary. She worked for a large agency at one time and actually implicated several of her former colleagues of partaking in this act. Incidentally, she told me she never did like any of the girls she mentioned....so I'm not sure if there is any real truth to some of what she was saying.
The majority of girls I asked say….it's a rare occurrence….yet it does happen.
One girl told me she had an extremely wealthy, elderly client that requested BBFS.... offering an obscene amount of money, because apparently this guy had a hard time maintaining an erection with a condom. Thankfully, she told me she just laughed at him. There’s no way she would play Russian Roulette for any amount of dough.
I agree with you all the way.drlove said:
I’ve been doing a little informal survey of my own. I’ve asked several SPs whom I’ve seen recently if BBFS was ever requested by the client. One girl told me she gets asked 1 out of 3 bookings, which is really scary. She worked for a large agency at one time and actually implicated several of her former colleagues of partaking in this act. Incidentally, she told me she never did like any of the girls she mentioned....so I'm not sure if there is any real truth to some of what she was saying.
The majority of girls I asked say….it's a rare occurrence….yet it does happen.
One girl told me she had an extremely wealthy, elderly client that requested BBFS.... offering an obscene amount of money, because apparently this guy had a hard time maintaining an erection with a condom. Thankfully, she told me she just laughed at him. There’s no way she would play Russian Roulette for any amount of dough.
so far, it seems far more prevalent than i would have suspected... of course, i assume everyone is being honest here.
i have been around the hobby for a few years, and have heard a fair amount on this topic from others here, on other boards, and in PM/emails...
there have been a few cases of SPs who offered it as a matter of course, in particular, the famous Helen of JT - and it appears that no one caught anything from her - they were very lucky!
in other cases, i have heard of a few hobbyists who have been offered it after seeing the same SP over many months and in this type of case it sounds like the sP is comfortable offering it only to that 1%-2% of clients where there is a long history of trust... and there might be relatively little risk here though, if i were a client in such a situation, i might be more worried that the SP wanted to get pregnant and then try and get child support!
i also have heard of at least one case where an SP offers it only sometimes - i think it is a matter of the SP offering it to clients she finds are clean and particularly attractive.
my point is that, while some of the above might be pure bull on the part of people who reported these things, there are too many reports to make me believe that this is purely happening because hobbyists pressure the SPs into doing it... men maybe more enclined to want it without condoms, but some women prefer the feeling "au naturel" as well.
you notice the last category in the poll - sometimes it can happen that people lose their minds in the heat of the moment but regain their senses - i have heard of a few cases like this.
i should have added one more category - which is cases where the condom broke or came off - did people continue without a condom if they realised it before the session finished?
i have been around the hobby for a few years, and have heard a fair amount on this topic from others here, on other boards, and in PM/emails...
there have been a few cases of SPs who offered it as a matter of course, in particular, the famous Helen of JT - and it appears that no one caught anything from her - they were very lucky!
in other cases, i have heard of a few hobbyists who have been offered it after seeing the same SP over many months and in this type of case it sounds like the sP is comfortable offering it only to that 1%-2% of clients where there is a long history of trust... and there might be relatively little risk here though, if i were a client in such a situation, i might be more worried that the SP wanted to get pregnant and then try and get child support!
i also have heard of at least one case where an SP offers it only sometimes - i think it is a matter of the SP offering it to clients she finds are clean and particularly attractive.
my point is that, while some of the above might be pure bull on the part of people who reported these things, there are too many reports to make me believe that this is purely happening because hobbyists pressure the SPs into doing it... men maybe more enclined to want it without condoms, but some women prefer the feeling "au naturel" as well.
you notice the last category in the poll - sometimes it can happen that people lose their minds in the heat of the moment but regain their senses - i have heard of a few cases like this.
i should have added one more category - which is cases where the condom broke or came off - did people continue without a condom if they realised it before the session finished?
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the one thing the above survey doesn't tell me is if this is the same few SPs who offer it, and there are multiple reports of the same SP, or if there are many SPs offering it. how much overlap is there? and how much BS is there - i find it hard to believe that 18% of hobbyists have done it with more than 2 SPs
so - please DON'T flame me on this request:
i was going to ask, out of curiosity, if people might email me the names of SPs who offered it to them...
i am not going to distribute this information or make a list or share it (except fot the conclusions i make), nor do i intend on acting on this myself (if i had that as a goal, i would have gone to see Helen of JT - who i new about before she left the business, or gone to see at least one other SP who i heard about recently)
i am a long time contributer here and can be trusted... PM me or send responses to misterxtc@mail.com
so - please DON'T flame me on this request:
i was going to ask, out of curiosity, if people might email me the names of SPs who offered it to them...
i am not going to distribute this information or make a list or share it (except fot the conclusions i make), nor do i intend on acting on this myself (if i had that as a goal, i would have gone to see Helen of JT - who i new about before she left the business, or gone to see at least one other SP who i heard about recently)
i am a long time contributer here and can be trusted... PM me or send responses to misterxtc@mail.com
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nearly:
i know that a few lists have been making the rounds - one of these was a list of SPs that do bbbj - compiled from various emails made to the person who asked for the info.
i do not have a copy of it - but if you do a search here, you could find out who has it.
but this relates to the issue that some people who might be on a BBFS list, or who were on the BBBJ list, did not actually provide the service, or would not admit providing it publically.
this is the problem with lists that circulate - SPs can be put on it who do not deserve to be on it - which angers them when clients demand the service, and pisses off hobbyists when they book someone and find that they have been mislead.
this is the difficulty - even on a great board like this, there is a lot of bullshit that goes around - people playing games and not being truthful.
i know that a few lists have been making the rounds - one of these was a list of SPs that do bbbj - compiled from various emails made to the person who asked for the info.
i do not have a copy of it - but if you do a search here, you could find out who has it.
but this relates to the issue that some people who might be on a BBFS list, or who were on the BBBJ list, did not actually provide the service, or would not admit providing it publically.
this is the problem with lists that circulate - SPs can be put on it who do not deserve to be on it - which angers them when clients demand the service, and pisses off hobbyists when they book someone and find that they have been mislead.
this is the difficulty - even on a great board like this, there is a lot of bullshit that goes around - people playing games and not being truthful.
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This is, indeed, scary!
At the moment, more than half of the contributors to the poll have admitted that they have had BBFS or, at least, been offered it.
I find this quite frightening based on the following assumptions I have made and the conclusions that derive from them. Of course, the assumptions may be false, but I happen to believe that they are fairly close to the truth.
Assumptions:
(1) The poll respondents are being honest. Since this is an annonymous poll, there is no reason to lie.
(2) The SPs who offered (or provided) BBFS are (or were) in circulation for (on average) at least one year and saw multiple clients.
(3) The clients who requested (or received) BBFS were also (on average) in circulation for at least one year and had multiple sex partners (SPs and otherwise) during that time.
(4) While not all the "offers" of BBFS in this poll resulted in the activity happening, it is safe to assume that:
(a) An SP that makes the offer has made it before (or since) and it is not always declined (why else offer it?).
(b) A client that requests BBFS will eventually find an SP that agrees.
Therefore, each of the votes in the above poll (except those that answered option #1 - Never) represents at least one case of BBFS having happened.
(5) Though BBFS is an especially high risk activity for the transmission of STDs (including HIV Aids) it is not the only risk available. Any BB activity including DATY, BJ, and even kissing represents a risk of disease transmission.
Conclusions:
These conclusions are only general since we don't have any actual numbers to work with. But when I think about the scenarios that follow from the information and assumptions above and I get quite worried.
Each of the BBFS SPs has seen (or continues to see) many clients during her career. Though she may only offer BBFS occasionally, she probably offers some other BB service or kissing to (some) other clients. Over time, she is spreading her risk to many people.
Each of the BBFS clients has seen (or continues to see) many SPs and though he may not receive BBFS often, he will seek it out when he can and also partake in DATY, BBBJ, or other BB services when he finds them available. Thus, over time, he is spreading his risk to many people.
Over time, many SPs and Clients who both don't look for or offer BBFS end up being with partners who have, or who have been with partners who have. The risk just keeps on spreading.
Before you know it, a good percentage of this hobby could be in danger!
Since we don't have the actual numbers, it's not possible to build a mathematical model for the actual risk. But it's lets remember that AIDS is not a the common cold! You only need to get it once to die from it and before you even know you have it, you have the opportunity to share it with anyone who engages in any BB service with you!
I'm not asking everyone to get out of the hobby. However, let's not forget that there are real risks asociated with this game. For those of you who have wives, husbands, Boyfriends, or Girlfriends, you are not just putting yourself (and the hobby population) at risk, you are also putting your close family and friends in danger.
Perhaps we have the right to take our chances in this hobby. I guess the SPs are also accepting this risk when they agree to work in this field. However, I draw the line at exposing innocent bystanders. That's one reason why, as I've said before, I don't hobby when I'm in a relationship. As I get tested regularly for other reasons, I also know that I have been safe, and lucky, so far.
Zog.
At the moment, more than half of the contributors to the poll have admitted that they have had BBFS or, at least, been offered it.
I find this quite frightening based on the following assumptions I have made and the conclusions that derive from them. Of course, the assumptions may be false, but I happen to believe that they are fairly close to the truth.
Assumptions:
(1) The poll respondents are being honest. Since this is an annonymous poll, there is no reason to lie.
(2) The SPs who offered (or provided) BBFS are (or were) in circulation for (on average) at least one year and saw multiple clients.
(3) The clients who requested (or received) BBFS were also (on average) in circulation for at least one year and had multiple sex partners (SPs and otherwise) during that time.
(4) While not all the "offers" of BBFS in this poll resulted in the activity happening, it is safe to assume that:
(a) An SP that makes the offer has made it before (or since) and it is not always declined (why else offer it?).
(b) A client that requests BBFS will eventually find an SP that agrees.
Therefore, each of the votes in the above poll (except those that answered option #1 - Never) represents at least one case of BBFS having happened.
(5) Though BBFS is an especially high risk activity for the transmission of STDs (including HIV Aids) it is not the only risk available. Any BB activity including DATY, BJ, and even kissing represents a risk of disease transmission.
Conclusions:
These conclusions are only general since we don't have any actual numbers to work with. But when I think about the scenarios that follow from the information and assumptions above and I get quite worried.
Each of the BBFS SPs has seen (or continues to see) many clients during her career. Though she may only offer BBFS occasionally, she probably offers some other BB service or kissing to (some) other clients. Over time, she is spreading her risk to many people.
Each of the BBFS clients has seen (or continues to see) many SPs and though he may not receive BBFS often, he will seek it out when he can and also partake in DATY, BBBJ, or other BB services when he finds them available. Thus, over time, he is spreading his risk to many people.
Over time, many SPs and Clients who both don't look for or offer BBFS end up being with partners who have, or who have been with partners who have. The risk just keeps on spreading.
Before you know it, a good percentage of this hobby could be in danger!
Since we don't have the actual numbers, it's not possible to build a mathematical model for the actual risk. But it's lets remember that AIDS is not a the common cold! You only need to get it once to die from it and before you even know you have it, you have the opportunity to share it with anyone who engages in any BB service with you!
I'm not asking everyone to get out of the hobby. However, let's not forget that there are real risks asociated with this game. For those of you who have wives, husbands, Boyfriends, or Girlfriends, you are not just putting yourself (and the hobby population) at risk, you are also putting your close family and friends in danger.
Perhaps we have the right to take our chances in this hobby. I guess the SPs are also accepting this risk when they agree to work in this field. However, I draw the line at exposing innocent bystanders. That's one reason why, as I've said before, I don't hobby when I'm in a relationship. As I get tested regularly for other reasons, I also know that I have been safe, and lucky, so far.
Zog.
It's simply unbelievable!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I never thought someone would be such an idiot to do it!
Every time it comes up again and again I'm shocked like it's the first time I hear/read it.
David p.
I never thought someone would be such an idiot to do it!
Every time it comes up again and again I'm shocked like it's the first time I hear/read it.
David p.
Re: This is, indeed, scary!
some people will click on an extreme answer just to screw things up for other people - its called "being a shit disturber" - you know, like mindless acts of vanadalism.
i am really suspicious about all the answers othat say they did it with more than 2 SPs - i think the proportions of those who offered but turned it down are more realistic, but that is why i am trying to get some more info sent to me privately....
of course, if someone has seen 100 SPs, maybe 2 or more is right - but how many guys here are up that high. from past polls, i understand that most guys who hobby frequently tend to find regulars that they will see for extended periods of time, or at the very least, find a few that they repeat with often.
so, who said people are rational???zog said:
some people will click on an extreme answer just to screw things up for other people - its called "being a shit disturber" - you know, like mindless acts of vanadalism.
i am really suspicious about all the answers othat say they did it with more than 2 SPs - i think the proportions of those who offered but turned it down are more realistic, but that is why i am trying to get some more info sent to me privately....
of course, if someone has seen 100 SPs, maybe 2 or more is right - but how many guys here are up that high. from past polls, i understand that most guys who hobby frequently tend to find regulars that they will see for extended periods of time, or at the very least, find a few that they repeat with often.
S
sara@select
Cathy, you have many valid points..and perhaps you are misunderstanding mine? *not sure* My fear is just that some men are delusional enought to believe that a "clean bill of health" may mean what was once considered "high risk" behaviour is now of little or no risk to them because they (and the provider) wave such a sheet around. My only point was that each and every person in this hobby needs to take responsibility for their own behaviour. They owe it to themselves, if not then to their families and the community at large. I think acting irresponsibly in any form should be discouraged- in general I think communities including this one need to be more respectful and less judgemental. End of my *peace* rant! lol
Sara
http://www.selectladies.com
Sara
http://www.selectladies.com
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You're crazy if you think you can stop bbfs. This whole industry is about sexual attraction which, for most, at some point becomes an uncontrollable desire or addiction, even if only for a few minutes.
Despite the many protests to the contrary, I think most participants in this hobby have bbfs at some point.
In most cases it probably just happens in the heat of desire. It's not a case of someone asking, it's just a case of no one saying "no".
In some cases the orgasm may be outside; in some cases on the lips; and in some cases inside. A lot of mpa's allow mini-penetration with a seeping penis. I assume that this activity is just as dangerous.
Don't kid yourselves ! Pay for play has always been dangerous and continues to be so. Your big head knows what to do; unfortunately, so does your little head, and it is often the stronger personality.
Despite the many protests to the contrary, I think most participants in this hobby have bbfs at some point.
In most cases it probably just happens in the heat of desire. It's not a case of someone asking, it's just a case of no one saying "no".
In some cases the orgasm may be outside; in some cases on the lips; and in some cases inside. A lot of mpa's allow mini-penetration with a seeping penis. I assume that this activity is just as dangerous.
Don't kid yourselves ! Pay for play has always been dangerous and continues to be so. Your big head knows what to do; unfortunately, so does your little head, and it is often the stronger personality.
Other dangers...
IMHO, not enough has been said about other dangers.
Sure, we all agree that BBFS in an SP encounter is high risk and most of us are wise enough to realize it is not a good idea (however tempting the sensation may be).
However, we should also stop to consider the dangers of some other activities that are very popular amongst many posters on this board.
Anything BB is high risk! That includes BJ, DFK, and DATY.
I find it strange that everyone speaks in a very united voice against the dangers of BBFS but many of us brag about the DATY, DFK, and BBBJ we have obtained!
BBFS is more dangerous to the woman (though the man is at risk as well). However, did you know that DATY can be almost as high risk to the male as BBFS is to the female? Did you know, that for the male, DFK can be almost as high risk as BBFS?
The other factor to consider is that each time a client (or SP) engages in a high-risk activity, they also make the low-risk activities more dangerous.
This is because the risk is nothing if both partners happen to be clean but in an SP encounter, neither party can afford to make that assumption. And each time someone in this hobby engages in high-risk activity, they increase the odds of passing something along that the rest of us could then be exposed to.
I know that people will continue to engage in high-risk behaviour and this post is not a call for that to stop. I simply wanted to express some of these concerns...I'm not sure what the answer is.
Zog.
IMHO, not enough has been said about other dangers.
Sure, we all agree that BBFS in an SP encounter is high risk and most of us are wise enough to realize it is not a good idea (however tempting the sensation may be).
However, we should also stop to consider the dangers of some other activities that are very popular amongst many posters on this board.
Anything BB is high risk! That includes BJ, DFK, and DATY.
I find it strange that everyone speaks in a very united voice against the dangers of BBFS but many of us brag about the DATY, DFK, and BBBJ we have obtained!
BBFS is more dangerous to the woman (though the man is at risk as well). However, did you know that DATY can be almost as high risk to the male as BBFS is to the female? Did you know, that for the male, DFK can be almost as high risk as BBFS?
The other factor to consider is that each time a client (or SP) engages in a high-risk activity, they also make the low-risk activities more dangerous.
This is because the risk is nothing if both partners happen to be clean but in an SP encounter, neither party can afford to make that assumption. And each time someone in this hobby engages in high-risk activity, they increase the odds of passing something along that the rest of us could then be exposed to.
I know that people will continue to engage in high-risk behaviour and this post is not a call for that to stop. I simply wanted to express some of these concerns...I'm not sure what the answer is.
Zog.
sorely said:
"oops - my dick is in your pussy"...
the responses include a category for this happening and then people stopping - if this were true, i think there would be far more votes under that selection.
most of the SPs and MPAs i have met are VERY concerned about risk - finding BBBJ in this town can be difficult enough - so I think you are wrong on this one.
