Anyone use Leasebusters.com ?
- Thread starter RayFinkel
- Start date
While I will say quite arrogantly up front that anyone who leases a car is an idiot, unless you run your own business and as such wish to keep all owned assets to a minimum. Leasing has becomes a means by which people obtain cars they cannot otherwise afford and there is a simple reason they cannot afford that car... THEY CANNOT AFFORD IT!
However if you have been foolish enough to go down this path you have to be careful with these types of companies. They have no fear and quite often become common names in the industry. They also go belly up on a regular basis and here comes the fun part. You do not in fact have a contract with them but rather to the bank with them as proxy. As such if Leasebusters goes bankrupt like Auto Depot did a few years ago, (I guess Michael Coren was being tested by God?), the bank owns your lease and thus your car and you may very well find yourself looking out the window to see your car being towed away by the actual owner which is the bank looking at a discounted loan to an individual which obviously fails their means test.
If you want out of a lease? Probably a bit safer since you no longer possess the asset but it would not preculde the bank from putting a lien on anything else you owned if they took the position that you had not fulfilled your legal obligations to the loan.
Remember when money is involved the banks were there when the legislation was drafted so such obvious statements like, "my lease was taken over and the car transferred" will fall on deaf ears.
Odds are that you will be okay but this business tends to be cyclical and it becomes much like an @Home scenario where new customers keep a cashflow rolling in to hide the fact that the balance sheet doesn't work, especially in leasing where it becomes ambiguous who actually owns the vehicle.
If there isn't too much more time on your lease I would be leaning toward completing it just so I could confirm its completion and closure.
However if you have been foolish enough to go down this path you have to be careful with these types of companies. They have no fear and quite often become common names in the industry. They also go belly up on a regular basis and here comes the fun part. You do not in fact have a contract with them but rather to the bank with them as proxy. As such if Leasebusters goes bankrupt like Auto Depot did a few years ago, (I guess Michael Coren was being tested by God?), the bank owns your lease and thus your car and you may very well find yourself looking out the window to see your car being towed away by the actual owner which is the bank looking at a discounted loan to an individual which obviously fails their means test.
If you want out of a lease? Probably a bit safer since you no longer possess the asset but it would not preculde the bank from putting a lien on anything else you owned if they took the position that you had not fulfilled your legal obligations to the loan.
Remember when money is involved the banks were there when the legislation was drafted so such obvious statements like, "my lease was taken over and the car transferred" will fall on deaf ears.
Odds are that you will be okay but this business tends to be cyclical and it becomes much like an @Home scenario where new customers keep a cashflow rolling in to hide the fact that the balance sheet doesn't work, especially in leasing where it becomes ambiguous who actually owns the vehicle.
If there isn't too much more time on your lease I would be leaning toward completing it just so I could confirm its completion and closure.
I disagree. I have leased many cars in the last 20 years. I DO NOT own my own business. I AM NOT AN IDIOT.Tarkus said:While I will say quite arrogantly up front that anyone who leases a car is an idiot, unless you run your own business and as such wish to keep all owned assets to a minimum. Leasing has becomes a means by which people obtain cars they cannot otherwise afford and there is a simple reason they cannot afford that car... THEY CANNOT AFFORD IT!
The reason I lease is that after 3 or 4 years I am ready for a change. I also prefer to drive something reasonably new around especially in the winter time knowing that it will start everytime. I have no interest in buying a car and then either driving it into the ground over a 6-10 year period or going through the BS in trying to sell it.
As for the question at hand - YES - I have used Leasebusters 2 times and with success. Basically you pay them a fee (300 the last time I did it) and they post on their website pictures of the car along with a description and the details of the remaiining lease.
Basically Leasebusters is the middle man between the person wanting to get out of the lease and someone who has interest in taking over the remaining term of the lease.
The transaction is soley between you and the person/dealer taking over your lease. Its minor paperword - the leasing company has to agree to the takeover - and the person taking over the lease has to be approved...just like any lease.
You are also able to add in special details. For example if you made a 4000 down payment to lower your monthly payments to 500 you would be able to advertise that you can take over my lease for the remaining 2 years for 2000. This way you are able to recoup some of your down payment money.
On the other side its not uncommon to see someone wanting to get out offering upwards of 1000 for some to take over their lease.
The bottom line is if you really want out of the lease this is a small fee to pay to have your car and your lease details posted on a site that has alot of people on it looking for the same thing.
leasing
leasing is not for idiots it's for many people for many reasons.
I have leased my last 7 new vehicles and been very happy with the entire exchange.
"Assume a lease" is another option and it's less expensive than "lease busters"
http://www.assumealease.ca/
leasing is not for idiots it's for many people for many reasons.
I have leased my last 7 new vehicles and been very happy with the entire exchange.
"Assume a lease" is another option and it's less expensive than "lease busters"
http://www.assumealease.ca/
I have known people that have found someone to take over the lease through leasebusters very recently.rayfinkel said:
Or you could just sell the car and pay off the lease. I've done that three times, there hasn't been any early termination penalty.
That is no different if you purchase a new vehicle and trade every 1-3 years.Sukdeep said:....depends on your definition of idiocy. When leasing, you are paying for the highest depreciation years/costs of each car. Financially, that is lunacy.
New vehicles depreciate whether they are leased or purchased, usually in direct proportion to the length of warranty and the anticipated time to major repairs and maintenance.
Working for a large corporation, I had company vehicles which I flipped every 14-16 months, which they found cost effective.
As an individual, I tend to look for low mileage 1-2 year old vehicles with lots of warranty remaining and a big chunk of depreciation already factored into the price.
Leasing is not for everyone but it is certainly a good option for more than just 'business owner". As a general rule of thumb you buy things that appreciate and lease things that depreciate. For the most part this is good advice. But only if you take the time to fully understand your lease and negotiate the terms.
if leasing was just for idiots, that would mean that virtually every public corporation and most private companies were run by idiots, because almost every company leases something.
Leasing Cons
-confusing for the novice. If you do not understand the way leases work, it can be difficult and often expensive to negotiate a lease. Consumer laws require dealers to disclose the APR 'cost of borrowing' but that is buried in the fine print. Most vehicles are now advertised via monthly/bi-weekly or weekly payments. it is extremely hard to comparison shop until you have determined 1) the purchase price 2)the purchase option 3) the cost of borrowing 4) the lease term to option and 5) the other purchase incentives that you lose by choosing the dealer's leasing program.
to do this you need to find a financial calculator with a cost of funds function.
Present Value PV= your purchase price minus any incentives that you lose by taking the dealer leasing program
Term (usually 'N") = the # months to the purchase option (24/36/48 etc)
Future Value FV= the purchase option plus any anticipated mileage charges or return costs.
Monthly Payment PMT= the monthly lease payment before tax (note that if your lease is anything but monthly, for ease of calculation you should show the equivalent monthly payment ie wkly pmt x 52/12. This will still be within 1/4% of the real borrowing cost)
Calculate COF ( often shown as i/yr ) If the borrowing cost is significantly higher than you can negotiate directly with an independant lender (bank etc) then you need to decide if the other convenience factors outweigh the additional cost. Don't be suprised if the borrowing cost is substantially higher than you might have anticipated.
-mileage limitations can increase your return cost if you are a high mileage driver.
-leasing cost of funds is often higher than borrowing cost from some institutions.
-total cost of borrowing for a lease is higher than for an equivalent term loan because more principal is deferred to the end (purchase option)
Leasing Pros
-ease of return. If you like to flip your vehicle every 1-3 years, leasing eliminates the need to dispose of your old vehicle.
-eliminate risk of ownership. Almost every car depreciates, usually much faster than most people think. In a lease you no longer take the risk that the speed at which your vehicle depreciates is faster than anticipated. In recent years, is has been quite common for leasing companies to lose on residual values because the market has depressed the value of used vehicles.
-Defer cost. If you flip your vehicle every 3 years or less, you can defer the tax on the purchase price. If you buy a vehicle, PST & GST is due up front. If you lease, you pay it monthly at no cost of deferral. Now if you were financing the purchase of a $40,000 vehicle, $5200 in tax would be added to the loan and would carry interest. Also, if you are aquiring a quality vehicle that you intend to keep for several years, a lease can defer a good portion of the sales tax to the purchase option date. (purchase a $100,000 Benz with a 48 month lease to a 50% purchase option and you defer sales tax until payments are due and a large portion( $6500) is deferred for 4 years. Assuming you were financing anyways, this is interest free money. (You do pay tax on interest though)
-accelerate your taxable write off. If you lease a vehicle early in your fiscal year, quite often your taxable deduction can be accelerated over using CCA & interest. (Conversely, if you aquire a vehicle late in your fiscal year, the opposite applies) This of course depends on the structure and length of the lease. Long leases with low payments and/or high residuals are not usually effective for tax write offs.
if leasing was just for idiots, that would mean that virtually every public corporation and most private companies were run by idiots, because almost every company leases something.
Leasing Cons
-confusing for the novice. If you do not understand the way leases work, it can be difficult and often expensive to negotiate a lease. Consumer laws require dealers to disclose the APR 'cost of borrowing' but that is buried in the fine print. Most vehicles are now advertised via monthly/bi-weekly or weekly payments. it is extremely hard to comparison shop until you have determined 1) the purchase price 2)the purchase option 3) the cost of borrowing 4) the lease term to option and 5) the other purchase incentives that you lose by choosing the dealer's leasing program.
to do this you need to find a financial calculator with a cost of funds function.
Present Value PV= your purchase price minus any incentives that you lose by taking the dealer leasing program
Term (usually 'N") = the # months to the purchase option (24/36/48 etc)
Future Value FV= the purchase option plus any anticipated mileage charges or return costs.
Monthly Payment PMT= the monthly lease payment before tax (note that if your lease is anything but monthly, for ease of calculation you should show the equivalent monthly payment ie wkly pmt x 52/12. This will still be within 1/4% of the real borrowing cost)
Calculate COF ( often shown as i/yr ) If the borrowing cost is significantly higher than you can negotiate directly with an independant lender (bank etc) then you need to decide if the other convenience factors outweigh the additional cost. Don't be suprised if the borrowing cost is substantially higher than you might have anticipated.
-mileage limitations can increase your return cost if you are a high mileage driver.
-leasing cost of funds is often higher than borrowing cost from some institutions.
-total cost of borrowing for a lease is higher than for an equivalent term loan because more principal is deferred to the end (purchase option)
Leasing Pros
-ease of return. If you like to flip your vehicle every 1-3 years, leasing eliminates the need to dispose of your old vehicle.
-eliminate risk of ownership. Almost every car depreciates, usually much faster than most people think. In a lease you no longer take the risk that the speed at which your vehicle depreciates is faster than anticipated. In recent years, is has been quite common for leasing companies to lose on residual values because the market has depressed the value of used vehicles.
-Defer cost. If you flip your vehicle every 3 years or less, you can defer the tax on the purchase price. If you buy a vehicle, PST & GST is due up front. If you lease, you pay it monthly at no cost of deferral. Now if you were financing the purchase of a $40,000 vehicle, $5200 in tax would be added to the loan and would carry interest. Also, if you are aquiring a quality vehicle that you intend to keep for several years, a lease can defer a good portion of the sales tax to the purchase option date. (purchase a $100,000 Benz with a 48 month lease to a 50% purchase option and you defer sales tax until payments are due and a large portion( $6500) is deferred for 4 years. Assuming you were financing anyways, this is interest free money. (You do pay tax on interest though)
-accelerate your taxable write off. If you lease a vehicle early in your fiscal year, quite often your taxable deduction can be accelerated over using CCA & interest. (Conversely, if you aquire a vehicle late in your fiscal year, the opposite applies) This of course depends on the structure and length of the lease. Long leases with low payments and/or high residuals are not usually effective for tax write offs.
I got my last 2 cars from leasebusters. Both times the payments and mileage were great plus the lesee paid for the transfer and threw in some cash for the deal. I currently drive a CTS -paying less than 500/month with over 45k per year as a mileage allowance.
Someone else's impulsive choices have been my gem finds in cars....and yes, I can write off my car and all expenses that comes with it because of my job.
Someone else's impulsive choices have been my gem finds in cars....and yes, I can write off my car and all expenses that comes with it because of my job.
You would have been financially better off to buy a new car and trade it in every four years. This is a no brainer UNLESS as I said you have your own business and wanted to keep your assets to a minimum. People are attracted to leasing on the grounds that it is better to 'rent' their car with lower monthly cash withdrawals rather than buy it and thus allowing them to buy higher priced assets than they could normally afford.yaya17 said:I disagree. I have leased many cars in the last 20 years. I DO NOT own my own business. I AM NOT AN IDIOT.
The reason I lease is that after 3 or 4 years I am ready for a change. I also prefer to drive something reasonably new around especially in the winter time knowing that it will start everytime. I have no interest in buying a car and then either driving it into the ground over a 6-10 year period or going through the BS in trying to sell it.
That said anyone can chose to do whatever they want but at least you should now what the costs are.
You make some good points but are stretching the use of the lease into unrealistic waters. Companies lease because they can capitalize their assets. An individual cannot UNLESS (as I said before) you own your own business and want to keep your asset value to negative.HafDun said:Leasing is not for everyone but it is certainly a good option for more than just 'business owner". As a general rule of thumb you buy things that appreciate and lease things that depreciate. For the most part this is good advice. But only if you take the time to fully understand your lease and negotiate the terms.
if leasing was just for idiots, that would mean that virtually every public corporation and most private companies were run by idiots, because almost every company leases something.
There are some ease factors that you raise that are true. It is easier to turn in a car on a short lease than have to sell it but in all honesty what was the last time you saw a financial windfall going the 'easy route'. Deferred costs are going to be either be revenue neutral but more likely a plus cost given the down payment and other costs amortized into the life of the lease and some true luxury cars, $100,000+, will depreciate at a lower rate and in some rare cases actually appreciate, (although obviously mileage is a factor here).
It's a simple adage you don't get something for nothing. The days of leasing companies being able to broker deals significantly lower than dealer cost to the public are long gone and given the economy not likely to change in the future. It is simply a more expensive approach in end as a means for automobile ownership. Doesn't meant it is wrong but as a rule it is a poor option utilized by people who let their concern for image outweigh their ability to pay.
However one very good point you made is the confusion factor and as such when getting involved in a lease, especially when a 3rd party is involved, most people probably do not have any idea who actually owns the car and what possible ramifications may exist if something happens to any of the entities involved in the deal.
Oh don't get me wrong! I love picking up the scraps from fools who bought too much car than they afford even on a lease. You can get some phenomenal used car deals at dealers with failed leases. Last one I got was 16 months old and it was completely tripped out with under 10k in just like new condition.healer677 said:I got my last 2 cars from leasebusters. Both times the payments and mileage were great plus the lesee paid for the transfer and threw in some cash for the deal. I currently drive a CTS -paying less than 500/month with over 45k per year as a mileage allowance.
Someone else's impulsive choices have been my gem finds in cars....and yes, I can write off my car and all expenses that comes with it because of my job.
Tarkus said:There are some ease factors that you raise that are true. It is easier to turn in a car on a short lease than have to sell it but in all honesty what was the last time you saw a financial windfall going the 'easy route'. Deferred costs are going to be either be revenue neutral but more likely a plus cost given the down payment and other costs amortized into the life of the lease and some true luxury cars, $100,000+, will depreciate at a lower rate and in some rare cases actually appreciate, (although obviously mileage is a factor here).
It's not always about maximizing your finances. For some the ease of being able to turn the car in on a lease may be worth the loss of money compared to the time and fuss of buying and selling the same car.
Yes this is true but it does not change the fact that it is a bad choice.Moraff said:It's not always about maximizing your finances. For some the ease of being able to turn the car in on a lease may be worth the loss of money compared to the time and fuss of buying and selling the same car.
Not to mention that I doubt your average leaser is worried about ease but rather getting more flash for less buck even if when the smoke clears and he turns in his last leased car he has nothing to show for it.
ya and so? The problem with that is what again? So leasing allows someone to drive a nicer/better car than they can normally afford. Therefore leasing makes cars more affordable. Sounds like a good thing to me.Tarkus said:People are attracted to leasing on the grounds that it is better to 'rent' their car with lower monthly cash withdrawals rather than buy it and thus allowing them to buy higher priced assets than they could normally afford.
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It's a bad choice according to you. That doesen't make it a bad choice for everyone.Tarkus said:Yes this is true but it does not change the fact that it is a bad choice.
Not to mention that I doubt your average leaser is worried about ease but rather getting more flash for less buck even if when the smoke clears and he turns in his last leased car he has nothing to show for it.
Like I said before I've leased many cars and the point for me is that I am looking for convienence. Nobody want's to overpay but as far as I'm concerned I'm paying a price for convienence. I want the ease of being able to drive that car back into the dealer when the term is over and leave it up to them to sell it or re-lease it. As long as you met the requirements of the lease and the car is in good shape (normal wear and tear not withstanding) there are no questions asked.
The last thing I need to be doing is entertaining offers from prospective buyers on my car that I wan't to get rid of.
Is it financially irresponsible to pay for convienence?
I don't think so.
And if that is the determining criteria that maximizes their happiness then that is their choice. You have no reason to complain unless they are trying to force YOU into the same decision criteria that they use.Tarkus said:Yes this is true but it does not change the fact that it is a bad choice.
No, it's only a bad choice financially, which is only one of several criteria to base a decision on.
For example I will not drive to 5 different grocery stores to buy my groceries just to make sure I get the cheapest of each item. To me, my personal time is more valuable than saving 10cents on a can of corn. Am I making the best decision financially? No I'm not, but I am making the decision that makes me happy. You may think I'm an idiot for wasting money, but in return I think you're an idiot for spending all your free time shopping.
Not to mention that I doubt your average leaser is worried about ease but rather getting more flash for less buck even if when the smoke clears and he turns in his last leased car he has nothing to show for it.
Parsimony is important, but it's not the be all and end all.
A lot of vehicles depreciate more than the cost of the lease.
The dealerships want people to buy at the end of the lease since the price is often more than the car can be sold for.
I think buying is the way to go only if you plan on keeping the vehicle for a long time to let the depreciation curve smooth out.
Otherwise, leasing is the way to go, business or not.
If you drive a lot the extra costs can be a lot on a leased car.
The dealerships want people to buy at the end of the lease since the price is often more than the car can be sold for.
I think buying is the way to go only if you plan on keeping the vehicle for a long time to let the depreciation curve smooth out.
Otherwise, leasing is the way to go, business or not.
If you drive a lot the extra costs can be a lot on a leased car.
Hey all I said was that it is a bad use of your money. If one's ego is so fragile that you are prepared to toss money into the cyclical money pit of leasing then go for it. But don't call it a wise financial choice.mac said:ya and so? The problem with that is what again? So leasing allows someone to drive a nicer/better car than they can normally afford. Therefore leasing makes cars more affordable. Sounds like a good thing to me.
No it is not financially irresponsible to pay for convenience if you can afford it and from your responses it would appear that you can. It is still a poor financial vehicle but we all make choices in this matter. However how does your argument apply to all those people who upsell themselves out of ownership to a lease, still remaining stretched to the limit on payments, who will find when the smoke clears that they have no asset?yaya17 said:It's a bad choice according to you. That doesen't make it a bad choice for everyone.
Like I said before I've leased many cars and the point for me is that I am looking for convienence. Nobody want's to overpay but as far as I'm concerned I'm paying a price for convienence. I want the ease of being able to drive that car back into the dealer when the term is over and leave it up to them to sell it or re-lease it. As long as you met the requirements of the lease and the car is in good shape (normal wear and tear not withstanding) there are no questions asked.
The last thing I need to be doing is entertaining offers from prospective buyers on my car that I wan't to get rid of.
Is it financially irresponsible to pay for convienence?
I don't think so.
The use car lots are filled with 1 - 3 year old cars that failed leases. I somehow doubt the convenience having their car towed away in the middle of the night was worth it!
Anyway I never intended for one little phrase to cause such furor when my primary reason for replying was to suggest that if you involve yourself with Lease Busters or any other 3rd party company that you would be wise to ensure you understand the ownership path of the company so you do not wind up facing what the people who got involved with AutoDepot did.
