A Social Disgrace!!! Men Beware.

[Chivas Regal]

Further to this thread from last year:

https://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17434

The saga continues. Further to this mans dilemma. He has subsequently won his court case, thrown out of court by the Prosecution, half way through the trial. Primary based on no substantial evidence, the PA told the court there are ` No reasonable grounds your Honour, to get a conviction beyond a Reasonable doubt.`

So this mans life has been reduced to the public humiliation of the charges, over a year of no contact with his children and on the edge of financial ruin.
In order to right the wrongs the is upwards of a $200 k legal bill to sue CAS and the Police- there was no investigation on their part. With unlimitted coffers, this in itself is a mountain. My question to my fellow bretheren is, do any of you know of any successful lawsuits against the CAS or the Police??
In determining his future this man needs some pro bono help on this question [and others].

Thanks for reading, any pertinent info can be forwarded via PM.

Chivas Regal.

 

[Goober Mcfly]

Flip side

I agree this sucks.

However, I'd rather see a thousand of these circumstances than one child put with an abusive parent.

Just saying is all...

 

[Chivas Regal]

I can only offer this as an addendum- The CAS are like border guards!

One must be very careful what they say to them. The whole experience is very Orwellian [sic]. The very agency that is set up to protect our children is destroying the relationships with their Fathers! I have examples of Goverment sponsered Web sites for women that say men should NOT be parents!

In translation, men are Sperm donors that should only be responsable for the $$$ upkeep of their children. Unfortunately Gentlemen the pendulum has swung so far to the right that many- Read, most men in this position are getting it up the Hoop! With so many men reeling both emotionally and financially the public needs to hear what are governments are doing to Men, and how they are destroying half of the population.

We hear all the time these stories about the abuse of women at the hands of men, and I agree- this is intolerable! However, that said, the government stepping in and bullying men only makes for a volitile situation, and if you know of someone in a similar situation, there are few if any good support groups for men to turn to!

Chivas

 

[Chivas Regal]

Goober in your off the cuff remark you have nailed it on the head.

There are about 1000/1 cases of this abuse of justice. And if you have ever seen someone go through this you might rephrase what you have said.

Do to the poilitcal Hot Potato that child abuse is, there is a Trigger happy response to any claims. Instead of thorough investigation by the CAs and Police there is only cookie cutter justice!

I would rather see proper interveiwing/investigation then ASSUMING that ALL fathers are BAD!

Chivas

 

[Chivas Regal]

Sheik, Clayton is a criminal lawyer and the criminal part of the trial is over. This is a civil suit which is not Clayton's expertese.

But you are correct, a high profile civil lawyer is definately needed!

 

[Goober Mcfly]

Chivas: It wasn't off the cuff.

I truly believe that in the cases of child abuse, it should be guilty until proven innocent, for the kids' sake.

However, if the father/mother is proven innocent, the CAS and police should back that judgement up with action, ie. allowing the father/mother full access again. (this is where the injustice is in your buddy's situation...)

So, in short, I agree with you.

 

[Sasha Jones]

Although I know nothing about the case, and it likely would not change my opinion anyway I feel that the CAS shouldn't be so quick to jump the gun.

It always seems that they interfere in families where there really is no danger and forget the kids who actually are in danger or being neglected.

I can't even count the number of times CAS was called on an aquaintance of mine in my hometown while I was in my late teens. This woman was a terrible mother, her house was a dump (literally) people were always drinking and doing drugs there. She must have had 5 other people living with her and was always pawning off her child on whoever would take him for a few hours so she could go out and party it up herself.
Everytime CAS came to "investigate" the reports of neglect and unsuitable living conditions she was called by them and told beforehand that they would be dropping by. ALways giving her enough time to con everyone into helping her clean the house and get everything in order. After all if they didn't help her she would lose her mothers allowance (welfare) and they would in turn lose their place to stay and party.
They never took that child away, I cringe when I think what kind of life that poor little boy must have now.

I have told men in situations similar to this, going through divorce, seperation, etc, that all women are evil.
If they think they have any chance whatsoever of losing their child or the life they have become accustomed to they will do anything in their power to keep it and/or make your life a living hell in the process. That includes accusations of abuse either on themselves or their children. I honestly believe that upwards of 90% of these types of accusations made by mothers are made to get revenge on the ex husband/partner. In all the years CAS has dealt with this type of bullshit you would think they would be trained to weed out this type of garbage.

It is sad to say that women are like this, but I have seen it too many times to say it isn't true. Women who stoop to this level absolutely sicken me whether children are involved or not. I can;t imagine that they don't realize what kind of harm this is doing to their children all because they are spitefull and bitter.

 

[i_am_good]

police services board

Wow, what a nightmare!

Without saying too much, I know of several current cases against the cops - even the Chief is named as a defendent. I will have to see if I can gather more info. I have forgotten which law firm is representing the plaintiff. I'll have to "look into it".

The case(s) is/are being tried under Rule 69 - Rules Of Civil Procedure. Initiation was done via a Statement of Claim.

 

[rdhaired_vixen]

C.A.S are blood suckin leaches on the bottom of the pond...
if your inncocent they make you feel like you should confess to the lindburg kidnapping when there done with you. its a humliating experince at best.. and i hope who ever nails these sons of bitches to the wall does so at great lengths and pain ..i know of too many people who are good parents and are laid out like humans for alien probing for these buttholes and yet cokeheads and neglectful abusive parents( lack of a more discriptive name) keep gettiing warnings..and their children still ahve to indure there poor situations.. sorry major sore point with me..

 

[Marshall Stack]

Animal Instincts

When I hear stories like that, I fall to the ground and kiss the very soil I walk upon. For some reason, I must have been blessed.

I was married for 12 years before separating and, considering the arguments between the ex and I during our life together, I naturally expected the worst. Nothing could have been further from the truth. If she wanted to, she could have easily made me look like a piece of **** in light of what I do for a living. My kids were never exposed to this side of my life and (hopefully) never will. Since our time apart, she has been rather understanding and she allows full custody on weekends or whenever I want to take the kids out for a treat.

I've been in a relationship for the past two years with a woman much younger than my ex, but she has also been supportive of that as well. In short, we're better friends now than when we were married and we both have grown to understand and accept this. The kids get the best of both worlds since there is absolutely no tension between their parents. Bonus for me is that they love my girlfriend as well and are not threatened by her in the least. Saying that, I believe that I am an exception to the rule.

Life can be so complicated but in retrospect, I believe that we are the creators of our own drama. This constant need for energy has us all running in selfish circles, putting up facades in order to receive that little boost. We say things we don't really mean, accept things that normally bother us, hide issues in the closet that might offend others, and delude ourselves into believing that we are doing it for a common good: keeping the peace. And all this takes place long before the courtship becomes serious!

In the end, we never get a clear picture of who our significant other really is and conversely, we send out the same false messages. This failure to be brutally honest with ourselves, I believe, is the root cause of relationship breakdowns, barr none. Most would call it a failure to communicate. There's no failure there at all. We consistantly succeed in hiding our true inner selves by consciously deciding against full disclosure. In the end, someone always gets left feeling either confused or cheated.

The other side of it, for those who are consciously aware of any acidic differences within their respective relationships, convince themselves that the other will change or worse, because of their love, would be willing to change in time. Reality bites those the hardest who deny themselves the truth. In the end, it isn't a male thing or a female thing. It's an Animal Instinct thing and god knows if we'll ever shake it. It serves us so well in other areas, it's become a tough habit to break.

 

[Sasha Jones]

Re: Animal Instincts

Since our time apart, she has been rather understanding and she allows full custody on weekends or whenever I want to take the kids out for a treat.

I think this is the perception that bullies men into thinking they have no rights when it come to their children. (Marshall I realize this may not be the case for you)

It all comes down to one word used "allows", how do men figure their ex "allows" them to see thier children. They are YOUR children too, you have as much right as she does to spend time with them.

 

[train]

I truly believe that in the cases of child abuse, it should be guilty until proven innocent, for the kids' sake.

So, in short, I agree with you.

In my opinion the doctrine of innocent until proven guilty should apply in all cases . To argue that child abuse should be different than murder is a "mugs game " .

As in murder cases temporary decisions ( to protect the childs safety until the case is tried ) should be made by a judge ( not CAS ) based on preliminary evidence - i.e. in other criminal acts denying bail etc . In the case of child abuse accusations , actions that might be available would include restraining orders , putting the child in temporay custody of CAS etc .

If there is no physical evidence of abuse then the mental damage of falsly accusing the father could be almost as damaging so the courts need to take a balanced approach. Each case once started should be followed through to conclusion and in cases of clear false accusations the accuser should be prosecuted for mischief . This would perhaps provide some deterrent .

I know a naive hope .

As far as suing the police the only case that I can think of is the one where that nurse at Sick Kids sued the police and the province for malicious prosecution and won . There was a murder case in Kingston but I don't know whether that was settled by the police or has yet to come before the courts .

 

[kwong_1978]

I can see the frustration that some may have towards the C.A.S. However, IMHO-A classic catch-22. Damn if you do, and damn if you don't.

I truly feel sorry for the father. I think our LE and judicial system should go hard on the genesis of the false accusations. Criminal charges (LE) & civil (father) may deter others.

 

[johnyboy]

However, I'd rather see a thousand of these circumstances than one child put with an abusive parent.



Sorry you’re wrong..wrong...wrong...but you sure good at making yourself look like a nice guy, but I bet you wouldn't be so generous if it was your life. Until you have been in someone else's shoes those kinds of statements are BS. This is the premise CAS works under. When will people learn that taking people's rights away will not fill the cracks that society is inevitably going to fall through? Our parent’s legacy is leaving us with a ridiculous national debt. What will ours be..?How we completely destroyed our rights and freedoms because we so self righteously thought we can save and protect the world...
It dosen't make it okay !!

 

[Chivas Regal]

It is hard not to respond emotionally in this thread.

Everyone has a good point on both sides. The problem actually has a name-
Parent Alienation Syndrome. The Readers Digest is that the custodial parent essentially turns the children against the Non-custodial parent. Due to the climate we now live in this is a very large problem. With the political sensativity being what it is.

Unfortunately my friend just happened to be accused after Randall Dooley was murdered by BOTH of his parents. Once again the CAS was involved in this case and dropped the ball.

Did you know for example that essentially you could call the CAS to report chilfd abuse on anyone you know and not have to stand accountable for your acusation. Therein lies one of the problems. The other is that interveiwing the accused is not a SOP of the CAS, or the police for that matter!

In any event, thanks for the responses in support and for your own protection whatch your back. If you are a single parent, don't put yourself in a compromising situation.

Chivas Regal

PS Thanks Kostobi, i will let you know after I speak to him.

 

[Chivas Regal]

Animal Instincts

It all comes down to one word used "allows", how do men figure their ex "allows" them to see thier children. They are YOUR children too, you have as much right as she does to spend time with them.

Sasha, unfortunately the courts don't see men as good parents. And when the dust settles-after much $$$$$$ it really feels like you are allowed to visit your kids! This whole dilemma is a time bomb waiting to explode.

For more info visit www.fathers.ca .

 

[djk]

http://www.mensactivism.org/

It's helpful to have a support network.

Cheers,

-djk

 

[luckyjackson]

Even with kids out of the picture, many men still pay a high price for antics of a minority of shitheads out there giving the entire gender a bad name.

My experience, (through a Slovenian friend at work), involved an immigrant who came to Canada without almost any english. He stayed with my friend's family until he got some money together, then moved into his own place. A hard worker, he quickly saved up a nice little amount in his savings account and started to make plans for the future. He was a good guy, but coming from a small village in eastern europe, was also quite naive.

He met a waitress and started going out with her. Communication was tough, but he thought he'd found the woman of his dreams. One afternoon, the cops show up at the construction site he's working at - and arrest him for rape.

My friend's family put up bail, which he paid back. But the following months were a nightmare. The woman had access to his apartment and bank account. She cleaned him out. After all of the preparatory work leading up to a trial was endured, (in the interim he lost his job), she did not show up at a preliminary hearing. Case dropped, his life set back by about a year, and a horrible experience to chalk up, all because this woman thought to make an accusation.

The poor guy swore his innocence up and down, but a cloud was left hanging over him and even the family who hosted him had doubts. Not too long later he arrived at my friend's house with a tape. The woman who accused him had called to laugh at him and goad him, and he'd recorded her admitting that she'd set him up from the beginning. Nice world eh?

 

[Goober Mcfly]

Re: Flip side

However, I'd rather see a thousand of these circumstances than one child put with an abusive parent.

Just owning up to this statement. Allow me to explain...

"An adult's feelings of injustice pale when the welfare of a child is at stake."

FWIW, I was in no way supporting bad decisions by the CAS. But IMO, I was saying that I'd rather the CAS and police err on the side of caution.

 

[luckyjackson]

Goober,

I think what bugged me about your saying what you said, is that it stands the old maxim, "better 50 guilty men go free than one innocent man be convicted", on its head.

The law is supposed to give the accused every opportunity to prove innocence.

I'm not saying you disagree with that notion, it's just that your original statement seemed to come close to the opposite view. I hope inadvertently.