Israel at war

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Frankfooter

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shack said:
Does it also surprise you that your opinions regarding Jews is a fringe and radical position on TERB?
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Why, you think the politics forum here represents Canadian values?
A reminder, 57% of the people who voted for Biden during the last election agree with me that Israel is committing genocide.
Your views are the minority.
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1778457908285673974
 
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Klatuu

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Butler1000 said:
Actually its more like, holy crap they don't share the same values of free speech, equality of women, human rights that we do.

Seriously we haven't had a war on NA soil since 1814. That's by choice. The ME Muslims have been at perpetual war with eachother and their neighbors. Hasn't stopped. Over religion. That's also a choice.
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Brainwashed. Lack of education
 
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Frankfooter

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shack said:
Sorry to shatter your fantasies once again, but neither of the UNGA or UNSC has passed any resolutions declaring that Israel has committed genocide. As Geno tells us, we must listen to the UN,
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Sorry to keep reminding you, old guy, but that's not how the UN works.
The UN has issued reports saying the occupation is illegal, Israel is apartheid and Israel is committing genocide.

When the ICC and ICJ come calling you will be whining and declaring some other imaginary goal line.

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Butler1000

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Kautilya said:
That is a different discussion. I am talking about what we see in the west in the media, in what politicians say that influence public opinion etc., You said they don't share our values.

Firstly there is a lot to unpack there because the west itself has engaged in horrible wars in the middle east where they have brutalized, tortured, unlawfully detained and sent people to concentration camps such as Guantanamo, thereby denying them due process which is an inherent part of western democratic values. They are also human rights violations which you said were western values. So the west itself has behaved in ways that violate our values.

Secondly even if you were to argue that the Muslims in the middle east don't share our values, that would not change the fact that we'd be guided by our own values. And if we were we'd find it very easy to collectively call Israel's actions genocide and terminate all relations with the genocidal state. But we clearly don't and instead cheer them on. Which would indicate to me that these are values we value for the purposes of rhetoric only.

On both counts that line of reasoning fails. The only one that stands up to scrutiny is the very reasonable assertion that quite simply as a society we have our biases and that we are no different than the Palestinians or Muslims from the middle east whether or not we throw LGBTQ people off of roof tops, or are engaged in sectarian conflict. We just engage in different internal conflicts and practice a different kind of oppression.

I don't care about Hamas. I have already said that Hamas needs to be taken out. But people on this thread and on social media, even politicians have repeatedly conflated Palestinians with Hamas and terrorism. That is what am referring to.
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Except Islam isn't just a religion. It's a legal framework and form of government. It is a Totalitarian form of control with Big Brother at its head. It leaves no room for dissent. It is cult like in its fanaticism. It follows through with its hatred of Apostasy and being an Infidel. It is also an economic model. Whichbis also nearly the opposite of Western practices.

It is, imo, the polar opposite to the vast majority of what a Liberal Western Secular Capitalist society represents and can build upon. Which I believe is a far superior form, despite it flaws. So this goes, to me far beyond the woes of a tiny population of near fanatics, who have screwed themselves. And I do conflate Hamas and Palestinians. They birthed them, raised them, and elected them to run things. They come from their own and won't denounce them. The hide them and continue to inflate their ranks. And follow the rules of the cult.

Sorry, I have no sympathy anymore. They have had amoke opportunity to be at peace. They chose a war to the finish.
 
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Frankfooter

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Butler1000 said:
Except Islam isn't just a religion. It's a legal framework and form of government. It is a Totalitarian form of control with Big Brother at its head. It leaves no room for dissent. It is cult like in its fanaticism. It follows through with its hatred of Apostasy and being an Infidel. It is also an economic model. Whichbis also nearly the opposite of Western practices.
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Was that post from here?

Islamophobia in Canada - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
 
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Klatuu

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Butler1000 said:
Except Islam isn't just a religion. It's a legal framework and form of government. It is a Totalitarian form of control with Big Brother at its head. It leaves no room for dissent. It is cult like in its fanaticism. It follows through with its hatred of Apostasy and being an Infidel. It is also an economic model. Whichbis also nearly the opposite of Western practices.

It is, imo, the polar opposite to the vast majority of what a Liberal Western Secular Capitalist society represents and can build upon. Which I believe is a far superior form, despite it flaws. So this goes, to me far beyond the woes of a tiny population of near fanatics, who have screwed themselves. And I do conflate Hamas and Palestinians. They birthed them, raised them, and elected them to run things. They come from their own and won't denounce them. The hide them and continue to inflate their ranks. And follow the rules of the cult.

Sorry, I have no sympathy anymore. They have had amoke opportunity to be at peace. They chose a war to the finish.
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Extreme racism. Poor education.
 
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Butler1000

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Kautilya said:
If they do understand the difference, I do not see it in action. I dont see it on this board. I dont see it in the press and I do not see it when politicians speak about it. Hence the very valid criticism.

Israel is not a race. Israel is a multi-ethnic, multi-religious, pluralistic nation. Hence saying Israel controls politicians in the US, via their lobby groups, is not racist. Calling this anti-semitic is a tried and tested tactic used by the lobby groups because once they shut down dissent, they can do whatever they want.

The word apartheid was a S. African invention. The crime, was not invented by them. Infact the crime today is defined by the UN. There have been plenty of regimes that have practiced apartheid and discriminated against a section of society before and after S.Africa. One example of a country that has continued to practice apartheid after S.Africa is Israel.

Jews did not invent Zionism. Theodre Herzl did. It was he who garnered support for Zionism in Europe by reaching out to the rich and the powerful. Meanwhile a lot of Jewish people back then were antizionists. It went against their religious principles. Hence antizionism is the default Jewish position and calling antizionism antisemitic, is antisemitic.

I will let Benjamin Moser, a Pullitzer price winning JEWISH author, educate you.


There are different sects, practices and schools of thought within Islam. There are also Muslims who are religious, not so religious, secular etc.,

Judaism also lays down the law for how you should live and govern.

No religion leaves any room for dissent. Islam is no exception.

So anything that attempts to generalize any religion, or its followers, and any negative speech based on those generalizations is racism.

Therefore both Islamophobia and Antisemitism are forms of racism.

As has been explained to you multiple times, the only bodies with a mandate to determine what is genocide and what isn't are the ICJ for advisory opinions, ICC to prosecute individuals for war crimes and the independent UN special rapporteurs, who provide objective reports of conditions in conflict areas. UNGA and UNSC are just countries who make politically motivated decisions. Not objective ones.
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And the Palestinians are followers of a more extreme version. I liken them to a David Koresh type following that has run amok.
 
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Frankfooter

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Kautilya said:
Jihad means "striving or doing one's utmost". The Palestinians are striving for their independence, which they rightfully deserve and are justified in fighting for.
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Its the same as 'from river to sea', when Israelis say it as they do in the Likud charter, its fine.
But if Palestinians say it then it means they want everyone to die, according to zionists.

https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1787637258037928318

 
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