Ontarian takes OHIP to court for gender-affirming surgery funding

[DesRicardo]

No. It is bottom surgery, and it is not going to look exactly like someone who was born male, but if it provides the function and aesthetic, and they are informed of the results and risks and consent to it, then where is the problem? It isn't for you to worry about because it is not your body.

There are many ongoing medical conditions and issues with these surgeries.

Half of trans surgery patients suffer pain, sexual issues years later

Researchers from the Women's College Hospital in Ontario, Canada, analyzed the medical records of 80 patients who sought care between three months and five years after having the operation.

www.dailymail.co.uk

And if they want the public to pay for this, then yes it is for us to worry about.

 

[Frankfooter]

I know right. And yet there are people who see it and ask what’s the problem?

Do you think after surgery pics of plastic surgery look any better?

 

[richaceg]

Do you think after surgery pics of plastic surgery look any better?

Plastic surgery is just that....a fake attachment. It has no biological function other than looking something different. It falls under cosmetic surgery which is t covered by OHIP, have uou ever had a mole removed? Dermatologists will determine if it's none threatening or threatening....if it's not, OHIP will not cover it. Heck even most insurance won't.

 

[dvous11]

It is not your body, for you to worry about aesthetics or function. If consent is given, then it is the person's choice to get it. Similarly, you may not be into dating trans individuals, but there are people with other sexual orientations.

You are just projecting your insecurities and issues onto others. You are talking as if only your opinion and judgement is relevant, good and valid. This is an inherently authoritarian position, which is typical of righties. They love to yap about freedoms, but do not respect other people's choices and freedoms, because it "offends" them. Righties are the true snowflakes.

It's called having an opinion and has nothing to do with insecurities or authoritarianism LOL.
The way we see things also changes when we have children.
I'm guessing you don't have any.
What adults do with their bodies is their choice as gross and retarded as I may think it is....but the whole concept of these surgeries for humans under the age of adulthood, without fully developed brains and bodies is fucked up.

 

[dvous11]

A lot of these are side effects that any plastic surgery can have. I had a liposuction in 2008 and I did not get feeling back in certain parts of my abdomen until about 2015.

And how many trans people are actually getting surgery? The majority don't. So even if they deem it is for the public to pay it isn't that much of a concern financially speaking. The only reason why someone would consider this an issue is because it is an LGBTQ issue that they oppose, not that they know anything about how much it actually costs the taxpayer.

Just curious, why did you have liposuction instead of changing your diet and exercising daily?

 

[dvous11]

I did. I had the lipo and tummy tuck, after I lost >100lb and had to get extra skin removed. So the lipo was done to remove some excess fat, to make the tummy tuck easier.

Gender affirming surgeries are not performed on minors in Canada. Hormone therapy is available after a medical and psychological assessment. Nothing wrong with that. So where is this issue of gender affirming surgeries on minors in Canada?

Wow, that's quite the journey. 8yrs to get the feeling back and that was just lypo. Can u imagine what these genitalia mutilations render?

 

[Mr.Gr33k]

All surgeries that impact skin are like that. They damage nerve endings and nerves take a long time to regenerate. Even a disc fusion surgery usually leaves a person numb in the pinky, for life. These are side effects and people go into these surgeries knowing and being informed of these risks. They are only mutilations if done without consent.

When someone fucks with your mind and convinces you that mutilating self is a great idea, it should be criminal. Instead, you're applauding it.

Btw, if one doesn't get oneself to a point of being 100+lbs overweight, one wouldn't need a lipo. Good, loving and caring people should've said something, instead of thinking "their body, their choice".

 

[dvous11]

All surgeries that impact skin are like that. They damage nerve endings and nerves take a long time to regenerate. Even a disc fusion surgery usually leaves a person numb in the pinky, for life. These are side effects and people go into these surgeries knowing and being informed of these risks. They are only mutilations if done without consent.

Consent as it applies to these gender operations is interesting.
When a doc makes $80USD to crank one out, and you have lefty LGBT social worker types encouraging a young person to go for it to transition, gotta wonder if the consent is generated due to influential bias....as opposed to honest friends, concerned/protective parents, and especially de-transitioners full of regrets offering support/guidance etc.

 

[richaceg]

A lot of these are side effects that any plastic surgery can have. I had a liposuction in 2008 and I did not get feeling back in certain parts of my abdomen until about 2015.

And how many trans people are actually getting surgery? The majority don't. So even if they deem it is for the public to pay it isn't that much of a concern financially speaking. The only reason why someone would consider this an issue is because it is an LGBTQ issue that they oppose, not that they know anything about how much it actually costs the taxpayer.

Are you kidding me? The only reason not a lot of Trans don't do it is because it's expensive...wait and see how that puts a burden on ontario health if they start covering it...you keep towing the line that somehow this is still acceptable and only being opposed because it's an LGBTQ...lol...subtle virtue signaling...this is cosmetic surgery that doesn't have biological functions...just nice to look at...OHIP shouldn't cover it...like breast implants....

 

[richaceg]

So anyone supportive of the person's transition is "brainwashing" them, and anyone who is opposed to it - are "honest friends", "protective parents" and "detransitioners full of regret"? You mean someone who is supportive of transitioning could never be honest, protective or trans persons, who don't regret their transition? And someone who is opposed to it couldn't be bigoted friends, parents etc?

See how you are not making sense and sound like someone who is actually brainwashed?

Perhaps people dont do it because it is expensive. May be others dont because they dont want to. We dont know. But whether or not it is a cosmetic surgery, is not for you or I to say. What do you know about gender dysphoria or this surgery anyway? Are you a doctor or a shrink? So let the relevant people comment on it and if it is indeed a cosmetic procedure, then, yes, the patients should pay out of pocket.

You can't tell if it's cosmetic surgery? LOL

 

[dvous11]

So anyone supportive of the person's transition is "brainwashing" them, and anyone who is opposed to it - are "honest friends", "protective parents" and "detransitioners full of regret"? You mean someone who is supportive of transitioning could never be honest, protective or trans persons, who don't regret their transition? And someone who is opposed to it couldn't be bigoted friends, parents etc?

See how you are not making sense and sound like someone who is actually brainwashed?

Bro, go back and look at that photo I posted again.
Then think about the articles that describe the massive amount of harmful life long post procedure complications, infections etc.
Anyone who promotes/encourages that to a young confused/mentally ill person is not thinking logically. They are either encouraging it for their own profit or to push their own LGBT agenda.
It makes total sense to anyone who isn't captured by Liberalism Ideology and/or the LGBT agenda.
Who's brainwashing me btw? The religious Right?....I can't stand them either LOL.

 

[richaceg]

It is most likely not. Cosmetic procedures, give you a certain aesthetic. Gender affirming surgeries on the other hand, are reconstructive in nature and the parts they create have function. A F-T-M, trans person, getting a new dick, is able to achieve erection - either organically or through a penile implant (And penile implants are primarily used for men, who have such severe ED, that neither the pill, nor something like the 3 shot works. So it is not just a trans thing).

If your argument is that because it is plastic surgeons performing such procedures, it is cosmetic, then why are reconstructive surgeries done for cancer, covered as medical necessities? For example, any surgery done on the face, for nasal or paranasal cancers, involves extensive facial reconstruction (because they basically remove your nose, your hard palette, etc, so extensive reconstruction to restore function is required). So not all plastic surgeries are cosmetic in nature.

The other question is if gender dysphoria is a medical condition. Certainly mental health related issues are medical conditions, and gender dysphoria could be one of them. If so, then is gender affirming surgery an essential medical treatment? I dont have answers for these, but it is for experts to comment on, and if it is indeed a medical condition, for which the surgery is appropriate treatment, then it should most definitely be covered regardless of what it costs the tax payer.

Your argument is that not all trans will undergo genital augmentation because they don't want to. I told you it's because it's expensive amd if they get it for free, they will....you move the goal post to erectile dysfunction...you know damn well what the topic is all about...and you know dam well what can of worms will be opened once OHIP covers gender affirming surgery...you just dont care...typical loonies....

 

[Frankfooter]

Bro, go back and look at that photo I posted again.
Then think about the articles that describe the massive amount of harmful life long post procedure complications, infections etc.
Anyone who promotes/encourages that to a young confused/mentally ill person is not thinking logically. They are either encouraging it for their own profit or to push their own LGBT agenda.
It makes total sense to anyone who isn't captured by Liberalism Ideology and/or the LGBT agenda.
Who's brainwashing me btw? The religious Right?....I can't stand them either LOL.

The studies say that there is very high satisfaction after the surgeries and that they stop some suicides.
Why do you care what these people do if it makes them happier?
Are you afraid you'll do a crying game and sleep with someone trans by mistake and go all gay?

Live and let live.

 

[richaceg]

What exact knowledge did you gain by looking at the photo? That is why I asked - are you a doctor or a surgeon able to interpret that picture in any relevant manner? What qualifications do you have to say that, that particular photo is terrible in some way? It could have been taken a few days or weeks after surgery, while still recovering? That picture also does not prove that said organ isn't functioning the way it should. That picture does not prove anything at all and infact falls in the realm of DIP (deceptive imagery perception) designed to elicit a reaction.

You are making a lot of assumptions. How are you asserting that trans persons, are confused or mentally ill or are not thinking logically? What is logic, when it comes to gender dysphoria? Who determines this logic? Why is counselling provided to them by qualified individuals, brainwashing? What is the LGBT agenda? Who sets this agenda? What is "liberalism ideology"? Who has come up with this ideology? What is its ultimate goal?

You are asserting a lot of things that you have no qualifications for and for which you do not have any data or information on, based on what you read on right wing culture war media. These are talking points, not useful information and since you are pushing this as "information", it appears that you are the one that is brainwashed and unable to think critically.

My argument as I mentioned in my previous comment is that they may or may not go for it. If they do not go for it, they may not go for it either because it is too expensive and they cannot afford it, or because they do not want to, for whatever reason.

How do you know? Based on what data?

No I dont know what can of worms it will open? So what can of worms will it open? Is it even a can of worms? If you think it is, then why is it a can of worms?

And I am not moving the goal post here - I am not even setting one. I am giving an example, to make the argument, that a new dick given to a FTM trans person, isn't just a cosmetic procedure, but a reconstructive one because you called it cosmetic in your previous post, which implies it is purely aesthetic. This is not the case.

Do you know how much burden on health funding surgeries like that will do? I do t know if you're still playing dumb or not....if it's reconstructive surgery you should use the term "gender affirming"... but you do so yeah...that sounds stupid...

 

[richaceg]

The studies say that there is very high satisfaction after the surgeries and that they stop some suicides.
Why do you care what these people do if it makes them happier?
Are you afraid you'll do a crying game and sleep with someone trans by mistake and go all gay?

Live and let live.

If a person is suicidal because he's poor, should we pool all our $$$ to help him cope...

 

[Frankfooter]

Do you know how much burden on health funding surgeries like that will do? I do t know if you're still playing dumb or not....if it's reconstructive surgery you should use the term "gender affirming"... but you do so yeah...that sounds stupid...

You think there would be that many surgeries?

 

[Frankfooter]

If a person is suicidal because he's poor, should we pool all our $$$ to help him cope...

And if a person is suicidal because of gender dismorphia you think they should just die?

 

[richaceg]

Yo

You think there would be that many surgeries?

You wanna bet if it's free?

 

[richaceg]

And if a person is suicidal because of gender dismorphia you think they should just die?

You think the only solution is suicide? How dumb can you get....maybe they should abolish psychology then if you think they're of no use....

 

[Leimonis]

And if a person is suicidal because of gender dismorphia you think they should just die?

We don’t live in a perfect world though.
If Ohip or even private insurance doesn’t cover certain cancer treatments why should this be covered?