Asian Sexy Babe
Toronto Escorts

Nuclear attacks in Japan justified - Agree or Disagree?

TVA

Banned
Nov 20, 2010
508
0
0
To fuji:
Of course it saved civilian lives, in Japan occupied territories like China, Korea, Hong Kong. Everyday, civilians under Japanese occupation had to endure unimaginable cruelty, including rape, slave labour, even live experiments on chemical and biological weapons.
 

Aardvark154

New member
Jan 19, 2006
53,773
3
0
To Aardvark's point:

"Strategic bombing", where it means attacks on civilian populations, were not acceptable. The fire bombing of Dresden should be considered a war crime, and if any of those responsible for it are still living then they, along with those responsible for Hiroshima and Nagasaki, should be prosecuted for their monstrous crimes against humanity.
a) it is Professor Tsuyoshi Hasegawa's point

b) ex post facto prosecutions of those who were there and who made it possible for us to live in the world we do, by those who were not even born and have no idea of that world is to put it mildly - not just immoral but mind bogglingly stupid.

c) the fire-bombing of Dresden by the RAF was done at the request of the Soviet Union.
 

onthebottom

Never Been Justly Banned
Jan 10, 2002
40,558
23
38
Hooterville
www.scubadiving.com
Agree

OTB
 

rld

New member
Oct 12, 2010
10,664
2
0
Dresden was a legitimate military target, bombed for legitimate military goals.
 

danmand

Well-known member
Nov 28, 2003
46,378
4,784
113
And a pretty damned nice payback for Coventry.

.
Bad example. The british knew about the Coventry raid, but did not tell the people.

PS: were the raid on Coventry not carried out by the germans?
 

red

you must be fk'n kid'g me
Nov 13, 2001
17,572
8
38
Bad example. The british knew about the Coventry raid, but did not tell the people.

PS: were the raid on Coventry not carried out by the germans?
so if dresden was payback for coventry, then that makes sense, no?
 

red

you must be fk'n kid'g me
Nov 13, 2001
17,572
8
38
japan in 1945:
5 million active troops in 145 divisions (includes three Imperial Guard), plus numerous individual units, with a large Volunteer Fighting Corps.
includes Imperial Japanese Army Air Service.
Japan Defense Army in 1945 had 55 divisions with 2 million men.
Total military in August 1945 was 6,095,000 including 676,863 Army Air Service.
 

nottyboi

Well-known member
May 14, 2008
22,447
1,331
113
I think the first bomb was justified, the second I'm less sure. If you look at what happen in Okinawa, the fact is the bomb also saved many Japanese lives. If the US had invaded Japan, millions of Japanese would have died in suicidal attempts to defend the homeland.
 

nottyboi

Well-known member
May 14, 2008
22,447
1,331
113
To fuji:
Of course it saved civilian lives, in Japan occupied territories like China, Korea, Hong Kong. Everyday, civilians under Japanese occupation had to endure unimaginable cruelty, including rape, slave labour, even live experiments on chemical and biological weapons.
when I read and saw docs about the atrocities committed by the Japanese, especially (but not exclusively) on the Chinese....I concluded "fuck them...." IMHO the Germans also deserved a few nukes...I feel little sympathy for what the Russians did to them considering how they treated the Russians. Karma is a bitch
 

Rockslinger

Banned
Apr 24, 2005
32,781
0
0
To fuji:
Of course it saved civilian lives, in Japan occupied territories like China, Korea, Hong Kong. Everyday, civilians under Japanese occupation had to endure unimaginable cruelty, including rape, slave labour, even live experiments on chemical and biological weapons.
Of course, it is ok if they do it to us because we are morally superior and we hold our countries to a higher standard.

I wonder if FUJI would feel the same way if the Japanese Imperial Army (nothing logical about those murderous bastards) raped and killed his future mother on August 7, 1945?
 

Rockslinger

Banned
Apr 24, 2005
32,781
0
0
I think some people said there was a third option which was to drop the bomb on an empty parking lot to demonstrate its destructive power.:Eek:
 

capncrunch

New member
Apr 1, 2007
1,802
3
0
I think some people said there was a third option which was to drop the bomb on an empty parking lot to demonstrate its destructive power.:Eek:
Yes, there actually was a third option of nuking a South Pacific island but for reasons I don't know that option was shelved. I recall reading about it during a history class in Univ. and it surprised me because I had no idea that option even existed.
 

Don

Active member
Aug 23, 2001
6,289
10
38
Toronto
I think the first bomb was justified, the second I'm less sure. If you look at what happen in Okinawa, the fact is the bomb also saved many Japanese lives. If the US had invaded Japan, millions of Japanese would have died in suicidal attempts to defend the homeland.
I don't always agree with nottyboi, but he's pretty much right on here. The Japanese were ready to fight to the death in a land invasion. Rough estimates was the death of 2 million allied troops and up to 20 million Japanese.
 

RandyAndy2

Active member
Jul 12, 2003
1,150
0
36
There have been a couple of threads on this topic over the past few years, and I'm not sure I want to get involved again. I'll state my point of view, but I don't expect to change the minds of any of the nuke lovers, and they certainly won't change mine.

In any case, the way I view it, the A-bombs that were dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki were weapons tests on live subjects, a conclusion to the Manhattan Project. As I've said before, look at the timing of the dropping of the bombs. The bombs were dropped in early August while the invasion of Japan was not scheduled until November, months later. Why the ungodly haste to drop them? Because the Americans might lose their opportunity for the weapons test if the Japanese surrendered. Also, why drop the second bomb? Surely the difference in psychological impact of eliminating one city or two cities (in the context of a bombing campaign against many cities) was minimal. Well, the Americans had two different kinds of A-bombs, and they wanted to test both.
Second, it was a demonstration to the Soviets of the new weapon that the US had. Ending the war was not the primary motivation for dropping the bombs.

There are a number of fallacies that those in favour of the dropping of the bombs typically trot out (and have done so here). The first is that the Japanese atrocities against their defeated foes justified Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The way I see it, nothing justifies an atrocity. A second fallacy is, "If they did it, it was an atrocity, but if we did it, it was necessary". Nope, both are atrocities and both are evil. The third fallacy is that dropping the bombs ended the war and saved lives. Hasegawa's thesis, cited by the OP, is interesting and makes some sense. Regardless, the US haste in dropping the bombs showed a recognition that Japan was close to surrender, and belies that third fallacy.
 

RandyAndy2

Active member
Jul 12, 2003
1,150
0
36
I wonder if FUJI would feel the same way if the Japanese Imperial Army (nothing logical about those murderous bastards) raped and killed his future mother on August 7, 1945?
I wonder if Rockslinger would feel the same way if the USAF (nothing logical about those murderous bastards) incinerated his mother on August 6, 1945?
 

Don

Active member
Aug 23, 2001
6,289
10
38
Toronto
There are a number of fallacies that those in favour of the dropping of the bombs typically trot out (and have done so here). The first is that the Japanese atrocities against their defeated foes justified Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The way I see it, nothing justifies an atrocity.
Yep, always easy to play armchair QB from the safety of your living room when you aren't personally affected.
 

RandyAndy2

Active member
Jul 12, 2003
1,150
0
36
Yep, always easy to play armchair QB from the safety of your living room when you aren't personally affected.
Isn't that what this thread is about, to a great extent? Discussion of something that happened in the past. But you only have a problem with it when I make a point, but not when others support the dropping of the bomb.
 

Don

Active member
Aug 23, 2001
6,289
10
38
Toronto
Isn't that what this thread is about, to a great extent? Discussion of something that happened in the past. But you only have a problem with it when I make a point, but not when others support the dropping of the bomb.
You are arguing that nothing justifies atrocity. I'm saying that it is easy to say when you have no personal feeling in the matter (unless you are older east asian (besides Japanese), then I apologize). I have a problem with your point because I do not agree with it
 
Ashley Madison
Toronto Escorts