Harper is scolded by the boss

danmand

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In an unprecedented diplomatic breach, Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao publicly upbraided Prime Minister Stephen Harper today for failing to visit China sooner.

“This is your first visit to China and this is the first meeting between the Chinese premier and a Canadian prime minister in almost five years,” Mr. Wen told Mr. Harper through an interpreter.

Mr. Harper listened, stone-faced, in front of Canadian, Chinese and international media.

“Five years is too long a time for China-Canada relations and that's why there are comments in the media that your visit is one that should have taken place earlier.”


Such a public scolding is unheard of in a meeting between heads of government.

“I agree with you Premier that five years is a long time,” Mr. Harper said in response. “It's also been almost five years since we had yourself or President Hu in our country.”


John Ibbitson on the Chinese Premier's rebukeThe Globe's Ottawa Bureau Chief on the public scolding of Canada's Prime Minister
Download (.mp3)
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He went on to invite the Premier or President Hu Jintao to visit Canada “in the not too distant future.”

It was the first meeting between the two first ministers, though Mr. Harper and President Hu spoke with each other as recently as the Asia-Pacific leaders' summit a fortnight ago. Mr. Wen is regarded as a highly capable, powerful and popular leader within China, although President Hu is its most senior statesman.

Mr. Wen's comments reflected similar criticism in recent days by China's state-controlled or state-approved newspapers, which took Mr. Harper to task for neglecting a China-Canada relationship that extended back almost four decades.

Within minutes of the meeting's conclusions, the Canadian government released a flurry of announcements on Sino-Canadian co-operation in the areas of tourism, climate change, culture and other fields.

In sum, the agreement represents a significant breakthrough in relations between the two countries. But Mr. Wen was clearly not willing to let the occasion pass without expressing his displeasure at the Conservative government's previously chilly approach to the Middle Kingdom.

When asked later by reporters about Premier Wen'scomment that he had taken too long to visit, the Prime Minister said: "My view is the same. I also would welcome to see Chinese leaders come to Canada more frequently and I think on both sides more regular visits would make sense."

Mr. Harper and his ministers made a point in the first years of his government to promote the cause of human rights in China and the rights of Tibet and Taiwan to self determination, arguing that Canadians were not prepared to sacrifice democratic principles when talking to China, and that such conversations would not inhibit trade.

This visit reflects the Prime Minister's evolution toward an approach that focuses on exploiting the potential of exporting resources, wares and financial services to the country that has emerged as Canada's second largest trading partner.

The joint statement of the two countries reflects Chinese willingness to engage in that approach. “I'm willing to have an in-depth exchange of views with you on China-Canada relations,” Mr. Wen affirmed.

But not before the Premier took the Prime Minister to the woodshed.

Meanwhile, Liberal foreign affairs critic Bob Rae and NDP Leader Jack Layton offered harsh in their reaction today to the unprecedented rebuke.

“Mr. Harper's provocative refusal to engage with China for four years comes with a price, which Canada is paying for, and which this incident reflects” Mr. Rae told The Globe and Mail in an e-mail this morning. He said the Chinese Premier's comment “is indeed unprecedented and deliberate, but then so was Harper's truly ignorant behaviour.”

Mr. Layton, meanwhile, told The Globe that the “public rebuke shows that there's work to do on Canada's part.”

“The new tourist designation and the consulate in Montreal are an important gesture by the Chinese, now it's our turn,” he says. “Canada needs to stop turning down so many Chinese tourist visas with a revamped transparent visa process that is fast, efficient, and fair.”

http://beta.images.theglobeandmail.com/archive/00365/John_Ibbitson_on_th_365342a.mp3
 

fuji

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China doesn't own Canada the way it owns the United States, so we can afford to turn our backs on them now and then.

It's only American leaders who have to bow to their Chinese bankers.
 

danmand

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China doesn't own Canada the way it owns the United States, so we can afford to turn our backs on them now and then.

It's only American leaders who have to bow to their Chinese bankers.
hmmmm hmmmmm.
 

hinz

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China doesn't own Canada the way it owns the United States, so we can afford to turn our backs on them now and then.
No doubt about it, China needs all the natural resources Canada can provide and do not be surprised their soverign funds are going to buy out Teck Resources and start a take over battle on POT and TLM, even HSE, with billions of USD ready for disposal/to burn.

Canadian dudes on the other hand are pretty content to get inexpensive Chinese pussies, as wives or SPs/MPAs, at the expense of the local white ladies. The dudes have fear that they are going to deal with white shewhales as early as 5 years from now, and pretty unshaven :eek:

It's only American leaders who have to bow to their Chinese bankers.
Kowtow like the Manchus Mandarins to be exact, like President Obama to the Japanese Emperor last time.

BTW, it should be Chinese Communist governments, not Chinese bankers since the mainland Chinese banks are allowed to open a single digit of branches in US, mainly in Chinatown.

As far as Premier Wen is concern, two thumbs up to mock Harper. Those neo-cons have no idea on how bad Canada reputation is tarnished by these mainly white Anglo Saxon Christian fundamentalists. Premier Wen is the only person spared from purging after June 4th Massacre when he was the secretary of the then head of the Communist Party and he is known to be the popular among the public, a "nice guy/good cop" in the party. Even he could not stand those blowhorn, small town hillbillies from Alberta!!
 
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Scarey

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China doesn't own Canada the way it owns the United States, so we can afford to turn our backs on them now and then.

It's only American leaders who have to bow to their Chinese bankers.
HEY!! look!!! all the American's are bowing....mmm..nope...just a Fuji ballshot.I can think of 1..2..um..3 folks on here who this is gonna stir up(grinning):D
 

Cinema Face

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When was the last time that President Hu Jintao visited Canada?

Tell them, "I'm here now, so let's get on with it, shall we?"

When the critics can't find any fault with what you're doing, they say, "you should've done it sooner." :rolleyes:
 

WoodPeckr

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Harpo is a good bottom and would never do that .....:cool:
 

train

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Gee it seems like only yesterday that Bob Rae was demanding we do something to express our displeasure over Tibet and perhaps we should boycott the Olympics. What a piece of work.
 

mexican

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I think that the whole incident is a face-saving exercise for the Chinese.
The "rebuke" was staged and both sides knew it was coming. The real rebuke was Harper not attending the Olympics and meeting with the Dalai Lama. That is about the extent of what a small country like Canada can do.

Harper made his point. In order to get him over there no doubt the Chinese had to offer something - e.g. pork ban lifting, tourism deal etc. The reality is that trade increased substantially under Harper's regime (double digit growth every year) and will likely do so even more now. The Chinese had to show their public who was boss but ultimately Canada will be the winner here with increased trade.

The Chinese need our resources and they have a favourable balance of trade with us. Sure there are business opportunites for Canadian business but those also exist with Brazil, India and Russia - and the US will not be in the dumper forever.

We can live without China - but their options for oil etc are limited. The "rebuke" allows them to win their point - and now become big buyers of Canadian resources.

I actually think Harper played it quite well. I think the Chinese respect him - much more than the suck ups - Mulroney, Chretien and Martin.
 

landscaper

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The chinese need our resources more than we need their cheap goods, there are other sources out there for those although we are a very small market point for them.

I get a kick out of teh opposition parties, screaming about human rights violations in China and at the same time crying because the PM has not yet gone there. Suck and blow at the same time
 

fuji

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I get a kick out of teh opposition parties, screaming about human rights violations in China and at the same time crying because the PM has not yet gone there. Suck and blow at the same time
If the government had a strong policy here and was refusing to deal with China because of human rights concerns I think that would be a defendable position.

However, the government has never expressed, nor even implied, that such a policy exists.

It seems more likely then that they have not engaged with China because it simply has not occurred to them to do so.
 

Aardvark154

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I think that the whole incident is a face-saving exercise for the Chinese.
The "rebuke" was staged and both sides knew it was coming. The real rebuke was Harper not attending the Olympics and meeting with the Dalai Lama. That is about the extent of what a small country like Canada can do.

Harper made his point. In order to get him over there no doubt the Chinese had to offer something - e.g. pork ban lifting, tourism deal etc. The reality is that trade increased substantially under Harper's regime (double digit growth every year) and will likely do so even more now. The Chinese had to show their public who was boss but ultimately Canada will be the winner here with increased trade.

The Chinese need our resources and they have a favourable balance of trade with us. Sure there are business opportunites for Canadian business but those also exist with Brazil, India and Russia - and the US will not be in the dumper forever.

We can live without China - but their options for oil etc are limited. The "rebuke" allows them to win their point - and now become big buyers of Canadian resources.

I actually think Harper played it quite well. I think the Chinese respect him - much more than the suck ups - Mulroney, Chretien and Martin.
Well put. Of course the other reality is that the Chinese Government well realizes that it can disrespect Canada in a way that it does not wish or dare to with the U.S.
 

Aardvark154

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Like keeping their currency artificially weak with the USD?
Like not treating U.S. Officials with the disrespect they did the P.M.,

The Chinese say no - but never to the loss of face level.
Since you conduct business there doubtless you know this.
 

hinz

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The chinese need our resources more than we need their cheap goods
Not so fast since they could get lumber and natural resources from the neighbor Russia and there're not enough slavic people settling in Siberia to stop the Chinese crossing the border if the Chinese are ever incline to.

Moreover the Aussie and the Kiwis are now "stealing" the export markets from us, when Harper and their white Anglo-Saxon Christian Fundamentalists stand firm on "high" moral ground, something even their GOP brothers like Dubya and Rummy saw the fallacy of such ideology without engaging China.

Even the Japanese, the Chinese arch-rival for centuries are now tempting to dump the alliance with the Americans and try to reconciliate with the Chinese. Whether the steep price to reconcile would be a combination of cancelling interest free loans to China for the past decades, apologizing to the War crimes, compensating to the descendants of the victims descendants and making sure their teaching materials reflect their grandparents crime against humanity identical to what the Germans are doing remain to be seen.

Like it or not, Canada is a back water in the eyes of both the Chinese and the Americans. The only difference is the Anglophones and Francophones are nice to the Americans and the Americans in turn act accordingly. Not so to the Chinese.

BTW, I get the feeling the Canadian need cheap Made-in-China goods include pussies, not Chinese sausages :rolleyes:
 

Mervyn

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In an unprecedented diplomatic breach, Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao publicly upbraided Prime Minister Stephen Harper today for failing to visit China sooner. [/url]
It's unfortunate that such a large county such as China doesn't understand basic diplomatic protocols.
 

hinz

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Well put. Of course the other reality is that the Chinese Government well realizes that it can disrespect Canada in a way that it does not wish or dare to with the U.S.
So true, the Americans play both good and bad cops.

Bad cop,

Dubya and their neo-cons in GOP dress like the cowboys "lecturing" the Asians, Chinese in particular by saying,

"Our money is YOUR problem. Nobody pointing a Smith & Wesson to force you buying our money but please be reminded you are either with us or with the terrorists if you fail to do so."

Kind of Ironic when China is the main trading partner/patron to rouge regimes like Iran, Sudan and Zimbabwe.

Good cop,

Obama and their union bros came to China all smile and gave a friendly reminder by saying,

"It's not your interest to witness our "demise". Sure you could dump our currencies but like my guru, Warren Buffett once said, what's your alternatives? Euros? Gold? I am pretty certain you guys are fully aware Euro fixed income market is not as big, flexible and liquid as ours. Plus we have more gold than the Germans and Italians combined.

Oh one more thing, my union bros are complaining you guys manipulate the Yuan. I know it's Renminbi but they are not that good at speaking Mandarin whatever. You guys better cease to do this. My treasury secretary Timid Geithner could speak Mandarin and write Chinese and he's going to repeat and clarify our position in..hmm Chinese just to make sure there's no lost in translation.

Still I love to be in China as I could again smoke indoors without my wife yelling, while watching your beautiful "trophies""

Who's a "paper" tiger? China? America? or Both? :rolleyes:
 

hinz

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It's unfortunate that such a large county such as China doesn't understand basic diplomatic protocols.
I guess you mean country, not county ;)

BTW, China understands basic diplomatic protocols but they are giving favours and doing something Iggy, Duceppe and Layton have no balls and guts to do so on Harper.

Or Harper could not handle the truth when Premier Wen described the obvious without sounding angry.
 

WoodPeckr

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The chinese need our resources more than we need their cheap goods,
There are plenty of other places, closer, to acquire cheap resources....;)
 
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