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Toronto Star poll over masks backfires spectacularly

bver_hunter

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We are talking about infection rates, not death rates remember??
And the debate is whether masks reduced infection rates in Denmark, which they clearly didnt.

Here's another one for you:

Portugal population 10.5 million. 5.5 million infections. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/portugal/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 2.6 million infections.No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

Heck, since you brought up deaths. Sweden had 4,000 less deaths than Portugal did.

So based on Denmark and Portugal stats you can make the argument that masks made things worse.
No wonder Ford doesnt want to bring back a mask mandate
Once again we have to reflect on the testing etc, where Sweden lacked it in the initial stages. They then brought in a lot of restrictions including the mask mandates later on.
Remember that Portugal, Spain etc were the First European Nations to be hit with the virus when it broke out in Europe. Their numbers were high to start with before the travel restrictions were imposed by nations around the Globe including Scandinavian nations. The restrictions were eventually lifted after the virus were seemingly brought under control. But that is when Portugal had the highest Per Capita Cases in Europe around the middle of January 2021. NO MASKS WERE IN PLACE AT THAT TIME!! That is when they started the stringent restrictions including mask mandates. TOO late by then. But why are you comparing apples with oranges as we all know that Portugal and Spain were the hub of tourism that brought the viruses in much earlier than the Scandinavian Nations, including Sweden?

Now I already proved that the Death Rates were a true signal of the actual infections as a sizeable portion of the population probably do not get tested for the Covid-19 and the true infections are not recorded. Hence the Death Rates are far more accurate in that respect. So here goes with a Nation like Norway that had the strict lockdowns:

Norway population 5.5 million. 4325 Deaths. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/norway/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 21,002 Deaths. No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

Yes over 2.5 Times the number of deaths per capita in Sweden. That is why the people were pissed off with how they handled it and it was only then that the brought in the restrictions including mask mandates indoors!!
 

Phil C. McNasty

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bver_hunter

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Stop trying to change the subject with death statistics, we are talking about mode of infection and whether masks stopped (or reduced) new infections.

HINT: they didnt
Once again you cannot accept the real facts. Proved to you that the Death rates are a more accurate reflection of the infections.
Remember that closer to our neck of the woods, how Florida has a far higher infection and death rates as compared to the whole of Canada. Why do you not comment on this fact?
 
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Carvher

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It is in the best interest of MSM to push for mask mandates and exaggerate the severity of covid because there is a percentage of the masses that are addicted to covid crisis as well as any other crisis they can come up with. It keeps them tuned into the station.
 

Phil C. McNasty

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Once again you cannot accept the real facts. Proved to you that the Death rates are a more accurate reflection of the infections.
Remember that closer to our neck of the woods, how Florida has a far higher infection and death rates as compared to the whole of Canada. Why do you not comment on this fact?
Death rates are a more accurate reflection of infections???
You're talking out of your ears now 😂

🤡 🤡 🤡
 

bver_hunter

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Death rates are a more accurate reflection of infections???
You're talking out of your ears now 😂

🤡 🤡 🤡
You still cannot comprehend that death rates are a result of the infections. Well maybe they died out of a different Mcnasty Virus!! 😁 🤣😂

But seriously, still no comments from you when Florida has much higher per capita Death and Infection Rates than the WHOLE OF CANADA!!
 

Phil C. McNasty

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You still cannot comprehend that death rates are a result of the infections
But deaths have nothing to do with how the virus transmits from one person to the other.
You know this and you're just obfuscating at this point now

But seriously, still no comments from you when Florida has much higher per capita Death and Infection Rates than the WHOLE OF CANADA!!
And still no comments from you why Sweden had a much lower infection rate than Denmark or Portugal
 
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bver_hunter

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But deaths have nothing to do with how the virus transmits from one person to the other.
You know this and you're just obfuscating at this point now
Once again a higher death rate is related to a higher infection rate. Otherwise, you have no explanation os to why Sweden stands out as having the highest death rate among all the Scandinavian Nations!! This post even clarifies it:

In April 2020, in the weeks after the outbreak was declared a pandemic, we looked at two claims that touted Sweden’s more hands-off approach as superior to lockdown policies imposed in Europe and the U.S. We found that infection rate cited in one of these claims was not a reliable indicator of how a country was doing, given that it depended on how much testing was being done; and that Sweden’s COVID-19 death rate was higher than two of its neighbors.

Hence you are living in denial of the actual facts!!

Some more facts for you to read and absorb:


And still no comments from you why Sweden had a much lower infection rate than Denmark or Portugal
I clearly explained to you as to why the KNOWN Covid-19 rates are lower in Sweden. Also explained to you why Portugal and Spain had a high infection rate to start with. Read Post #161 again. Now when I compare apples with apples with a country like Norway v Sweden, and a State like Florida v Canada, you are silent with regards to those FACTS!!
 

Phil C. McNasty

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Once again a higher death rate is related to a higher infection rate
You're trying to bullshit your way out of this.
Masks are supposed to prevent initial infections. Deaths come many days, weeks or months after that, and have no bearing on the debate whether masks reduce new infections, which the data shows they didnt

I clearly explained to you as to why the KNOWN Covid-19 rates are lower in Sweden. Also explained to you why Portugal and Spain had a high infection rate to start with. Read Post #161 again. Now when I compare apples with apples with a country like Norway v Sweden, and a State like Florida v Canada, you are silent with regards to those FACTS!!
Sweden, 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
Denmark, 3.1 million infections. Strict mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/denmark/

Portugal population 10.5 million. 5.5 million infections. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/portugal/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

US data: https://nypost.com/2022/04/19/feel-free-to-fly-maskless-breathe-easier-already/

 
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basketcase

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bver_hunter

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You're trying to bullshit your way out of this.
Masks are supposed to prevent initial infections. Deaths come many days, weeks or months after that, and have no bearing on the debate whether masks reduce new infections, which the data shows they didnt


Sweden, 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
Denmark, 3.1 million infections. Strict mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/denmark/

Portugal population 10.5 million. 5.5 million infections. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/portugal/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

US data: https://nypost.com/2022/04/19/feel-free-to-fly-maskless-breathe-easier-already/

Read Post#168 again, as you just cannot accept the real facts!!
How are deaths not related to the infections in the first place. Again you live in denial of the fact that many of those infected have not even been tested.
They stay at home normally and are back in business as soon as they feel well enough to venture out. The Deaths are proportional to the Infections, unless the Swedes have pathetically compromised immune systems as you seem to imply!! So once again when you compare apples with apples:

Norway population 5.5 million. 4325 Deaths. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/norway/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 21,002 Deaths. Limited mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

Yes over 2.5 Times the number of deaths per capita in Sweden. That is why the people were pissed off with how they handled it and it was only then that the brought in the restrictions including mask mandates indoors!!

Well something for you to read and absorb when two countries with traditionally similar socioeconomics and healthcare system. Their population demographics are very comparable as was their life expectancy and death rates prior to the Pandemic. Now follow the Science with assessing the reasoning behind their death rates during the Pandemic:

Mortality in Norway and Sweden during the COVID-19 pandemic

Aims
To compare mortality in Norway and Sweden, two similar countries with very different mitigation measures against COVID-19.

Discussion
Our study shows that, in Norway, the all-cause mortality rates in 2020 were lower than or similar to the five preceding years for all age groups. In Sweden, the all-cause mortality rates in 2020 were similar to or higher than in previous years for people older than 70 years, but lower for people younger than 70 years. The COVID-19-associated mortality rate was almost ten-fold higher (2.9 versus 0.3 per 100,000 person-weeks) in Sweden than in Norway and the peaks of COVID-19 cause-specific deaths corresponded to the observed peaks in all-cause mortality (Figure 1).

 
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Phil C. McNasty

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From the same guy who complains that uncontextualized stats he doesn't like are fake.

Uno!
Nothing fake about these stats

Sweden, 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
Denmark, 3.1 million infections. Strict mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/denmark/

Portugal population 10.5 million. 5.5 million infections. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/portugal/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

US data: https://nypost.com/2022/04/19/feel-free-to-fly-maskless-breathe-easier-already/

[URL
 
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Phil C. McNasty

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Dec 27, 2010
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Read Post#168 again, as you just cannot accept the real facts!!
How are deaths not related to the infections in the first place. Again you live in denial of the fact that many of those infected have not even been tested.
They stay at home normally and are back in business as soon as they feel well enough to venture out. The Deaths are proportional to the Infections, unless the Swedes have pathetically compromised immune systems as you seem to imply!! So once again when you compare apples with apples:

Norway population 5.5 million. 4325 Deaths. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/norway/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 21,002 Deaths. Limited mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

Yes over 2.5 Times the number of deaths per capita in Sweden. That is why the people were pissed off with how they handled it and it was only then that the brought in the restrictions including mask mandates indoors!!

Well something for you to read and absorb when two countries with traditionally similar socioeconomics and healthcare system. Their population demographics are very comparable as was their life expectancy and death rates prior to the Pandemic. Now follow the Science with assessing the reasoning behind their death rates during the Pandemic:

Mortality in Norway and Sweden during the COVID-19 pandemic

Aims
To compare mortality in Norway and Sweden, two similar countries with very different mitigation measures against COVID-19.

Discussion
Our study shows that, in Norway, the all-cause mortality rates in 2020 were lower than or similar to the five preceding years for all age groups. In Sweden, the all-cause mortality rates in 2020 were similar to or higher than in previous years for people older than 70 years, but lower for people younger than 70 years. The COVID-19-associated mortality rate was almost ten-fold higher (2.9 versus 0.3 per 100,000 person-weeks) in Sweden than in Norway and the peaks of COVID-19 cause-specific deaths corresponded to the observed peaks in all-cause mortality (Figure 1).

Sweden, 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
Denmark, 3.1 million infections. Strict mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/denmark/

Portugal population 10.5 million. 5.5 million infections. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/portugal/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

US data: https://nypost.com/2022/04/19/feel-free-to-fly-maskless-breathe-easier-already/

 

basketcase

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Dec 29, 2005
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Keep spamming that unsourced graph made by a guy trying to prove a point.

I still see you're avoiding the comparisons between Florida and Canada.
 
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bver_hunter

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Sweden, 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
Denmark, 3.1 million infections. Strict mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/denmark/

Portugal population 10.5 million. 5.5 million infections. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/portugal/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

US data: https://nypost.com/2022/04/19/feel-free-to-fly-maskless-breathe-easier-already/

 

Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
25,136
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Sweden, 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
Denmark, 3.1 million infections. Strict mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/denmark/

Portugal population 10.5 million. 5.5 million infections. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/portugal/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

US data: https://nypost.com/2022/04/19/feel-free-to-fly-maskless-breathe-easier-already/

 

Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
25,136
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Keep spamming that unsourced graph made by a guy trying to prove a point.

I still see you're avoiding the comparisons between Florida and Canada.
Comparing ONLY Florida to Canada is cherry-picking, you have to compare data from all over the US and rest of the world.

Sweden, 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
Denmark, 3.1 million infections. Strict mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/denmark/

Portugal population 10.5 million. 5.5 million infections. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/portugal/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

US data: https://nypost.com/2022/04/19/feel-free-to-fly-maskless-breathe-easier-already/

 

bver_hunter

Well-known member
Nov 5, 2005
27,331
5,556
113
Comparing ONLY Florida to Canada is cherry-picking, you have to compare data from all over the US and rest of the world.

Sweden, 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/
Denmark, 3.1 million infections. Strict mask mandate https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/denmark/

Portugal population 10.5 million. 5.5 million infections. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/portugal/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 2.6 million infections. No mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

US data: https://nypost.com/2022/04/19/feel-free-to-fly-maskless-breathe-easier-already/



Once again the real data with the comparison of apples and apples:

Read Post#168 again, as you just cannot accept the real facts!!
How are deaths not related to the infections in the first place. Again you live in denial of the fact that many of those infected have not even been tested.
They stay at home normally and are back in business as soon as they feel well enough to venture out. The Deaths are proportional to the Infections, unless the Swedes have pathetically compromised immune systems as you seem to imply!! So once again when you compare apples with apples:

Norway population 5.5 million. 4325 Deaths. Strict mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/norway/
Sweden population 10.5 million. 21,002 Deaths. Limited mask mandate: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/sweden/

Yes over 2.5 Times the number of deaths per capita in Sweden. That is why the people were pissed off with how they handled it and it was only then that the brought in the restrictions including mask mandates indoors!!

Well something for you to read and absorb when two countries with traditionally similar socioeconomics and healthcare system. Their population demographics are very comparable as was their life expectancy and death rates prior to the Pandemic. Now follow the Science with assessing the reasoning behind their death rates during the Pandemic:

Mortality in Norway and Sweden during the COVID-19 pandemic

Aims
To compare mortality in Norway and Sweden, two similar countries with very different mitigation measures against COVID-19.

Discussion
Our study shows that, in Norway, the all-cause mortality rates in 2020 were lower than or similar to the five preceding years for all age groups. In Sweden, the all-cause mortality rates in 2020 were similar to or higher than in previous years for people older than 70 years, but lower for people younger than 70 years. The COVID-19-associated mortality rate was almost ten-fold higher (2.9 versus 0.3 per 100,000 person-weeks) in Sweden than in Norway and the peaks of COVID-19 cause-specific deaths corresponded to the observed peaks in all-cause mortality (Figure 1).

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/14034948211047137

Then Canada v Florida:

Florida has one of the highest seven-day COVID-19 case rates per 100,000 people in the United States at 1,772.8, according to data from the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. By contrast, the rate of COVID-19 cases in Canada over the last seven days was 678 per 100,000 people as of Jan. 3. For comparison, Florida has a population of about 21.7 million, while 38.5 million people currently live in Canada.

So far, Florida has recorded more than 4.3 million cases of coronavirus and 62,541 related deaths. Canada, by comparison, so far has a total of about 2.3 million cases of COVID-19 and 30,456 deaths, based on data compiled by CTVNews.ca.


 
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