I stand corrected! Thanks for clearing that one up.
Thanks!
xo
Yu are right! It was the Chiffons. I thought it was the Dells.Neverenuff$ said:
Thanks!
xo
No one ever warned you, boy! Rock and Roll is a vicious game!
- Thread starter da-DELETED-hliafrommerb
- Start date
Get The Led Out
.Of course I did not grow up in the 70's, Was not even born yet, but I am a Classic Rock fan. Interesting thread guys. But ask yourself has anything really changed in the music industry today. Thirty years from now it will be some other rapper/band etc and some other you tuber pointing out who ripped who. So the song remains the same and it is time to turn the page. Because like the lines in the mirror the lines on your face get deeper, and that is life in the fast lane. Back then who could remember who did what they all had cocaine running around their brain.
.Of course I did not grow up in the 70's, Was not even born yet, but I am a Classic Rock fan. Interesting thread guys. But ask yourself has anything really changed in the music industry today. Thirty years from now it will be some other rapper/band etc and some other you tuber pointing out who ripped who. So the song remains the same and it is time to turn the page. Because like the lines in the mirror the lines on your face get deeper, and that is life in the fast lane. Back then who could remember who did what they all had cocaine running around their brain.
It's a cruel world out there. Maybe Led Zep, Jimmy Page, whoever, did steal as you put it but from what I understand, all they have to do is make some changes throughout the song and it can be used.
I say good for him if he did steal and got rich from it. LZ was a good band and I still like their music. Reading this doesn't change how I look at LZ or Jimmy Page.
I say good for him if he did steal and got rich from it. LZ was a good band and I still like their music. Reading this doesn't change how I look at LZ or Jimmy Page.
I nominate this as the
Worst
Thread
Ever.
BTW, my aunt had several Led Zepplin LP's and she thought that they were a blues band with some of that bad rock influence.
Worst
Thread
Ever.
BTW, my aunt had several Led Zepplin LP's and she thought that they were a blues band with some of that bad rock influence.
This “controversy” is ancient history. If you could steal the blues, Eric Clapton should be incarcerated, and Willie Dixon is burning in hell. Did Zeppelin take (and improve on) some lyrics and chord progressions and musical themes long in existence? Why, yes they did. So did most of the top blues artists and rockers in history, including the Beatles and Rolling Stones. Had the originators of the blues not been a horrifically oppressed people, no doubt we’d all feel much less uneasy about white folks making millions off the evolution of that music. OTOH, I would not know who Robert Johnson was if not for Robert Plant. Roughly 10% of their music has long since been officially credited to other people, and the remaining 90% leaves them, far and away, the most original and innovative rock band in history. Doesn’t it make you wonder how “the greatest Classic Rock song of all time (repeatedly, year after year #1 on countdown after countdown)” has somehow escaped the lawyers’ attention? Basically, Robert Plant and Jimmy Page are guilty of having excellent musical taste. They tried to get away with what others before them had always gotten away with, but that train had left the station and they were caught out. If they weren’t so successful, no one would care, and they’ve been borrowed from for 35 years in their turn, so all’s right with the world…
This is all old news, but it was interesting reading.
Musicians have been "stealing" from one another for centuries. Even classical composers stole from one another. Watch the movie Amadeus.
Rap "musicians" are the worst....only they call it "sampling".
I don't think there is an "original" idea left.
Where it becomes a "sticky wicket" is when you profit from something you've stolen, and won't share with the original artist.
Musicians have been "stealing" from one another for centuries. Even classical composers stole from one another. Watch the movie Amadeus.
Rap "musicians" are the worst....only they call it "sampling".
I don't think there is an "original" idea left.
Where it becomes a "sticky wicket" is when you profit from something you've stolen, and won't share with the original artist.
Interesting reading, indeed! (Part 1)
Hi-ee everyone,
Thanks for your comments.
I want to try to adress some of these comments, as best as i can, without sounding too harsh.
First of all, what really caught my eye was a couple of people saying things like, "It's ok to steal and get rich from it." Geez.
The Beatles gave credit to the original composers of the songs they covered:
This Boy, Long Tall Sally, Match Box, to name only a few of the songs covered by The Beatles. They are not guilty of any copyright infringements.
Elvis Presley was guilty, or his manager were, to large a degree, by forcing others to give Elvis half credit to songs he never even composed just so that he would sing them so he and they could make money. If they did not agree to have Elvis' name on the record, well then their songs would not be recorded by Elvis. BUT those artists did agree to do it!! It was that, or no record. That is shrewed business, but THAT was presented as such to the artists. They could have walked away saying, "no no!"
Rap artists were mentioned but check out the liner notes of those rap CD's. Credit is given to the original artists, even noting where the rap artists borrowed the samples from. Nothing is wrong with that. Credit was given, at that means those artists will receive their shares of royalties for any air-play or performances. All fine and legal and proper.
Clapton was mentioned, too, by somebody. Well, i can't be 100% sure if Clapton infringed on anyone's copyrights, but it does seem to me that he didn't, as i look at a CD i am holding in my hand, of a Cream and Yardbyrds compilation which says in the liner notes, "probably recorded in 1963". They give credit to Willie Dixon and some guy named, "Smith" for a song called, Big Boss Man. Whether or not the "Smith" mentioned, is in fact, Paul Samuel Smith of the Yardbyrds is unknown to me. However, Willie Dixon's name is mentioned and that is what i am talking about!
Stormy Monday has the name, (T. Bone) "Walker" under it. There is even a song called, Eric's Blues and that one gives credit to, Sponsor/Reklov as the composers.
The Yardbyrds gave credit to the original composers even on their biggest hits, For Your Love, which gives credit to Graham Gouldman, whoever HE is, or was. The thing to consider here is simple, now we can know who Graham Gouldman was. And he made money from that song being used. Kudos to The Yardbyrds! Another big hit by them was called, A Certain Girl , and it says, "Neville" is the composer.
Eric Clapton has been logged in history as refusing to play with anyone who didn't know who Robert Johnson was. So, I hardly think Clapton is guilty of copyright infringement.
Playing the blues, itself, does make one a thief. Discrediting others, à la Jimmy Page, does.
Someone said in this thread, "I would not know who Robert Johnson was if not for Robert Plant." Maybe he is referring to, The Lemon Song on Zep's 2nd album. Plant sings, "You can squeeze my lemon til the juice runs down my leg". No credit was given to Robert Johnson or to his song, Travelling Riverside Blues, where Plant stole those lyrics from. Maybe later, after every one had been sued, and the story was told, did he start to admit that he sang other people's lines. It still doesn't make it all better.
All of Zep's early albums' success are because many people thought Page (back then) was some kind of blues mastermind. When Zep 1 and 2 were recorded, Plant wasn't able to have his name as a songwriter due to a previous contract he signed. So, Page took most of the stolen credit, and instead of giving credit where it was due, he decided it was fair to sign himself, along with Bonham and Jones as writers. So wrong to have done that! And Page was Zeppelin's producer, so he had all creative, musical control over all Zeppelin's songs.
True enough, many of the old bluesmen in the south borrowed guitar riff's and even songs from other bluesmen of the day, but they were sure to mention, in most cases that they did. Maybe some didn't, who's to say? But 'race music' was not a billion dollar industry in the rural deep south at that time. No one was getting rich, then.
They would just travel from plantation to plantation to perform.
As far as classical composers stealing music from other classical composers. I doubt that very much. We can see classical recordings of say, Wagner, and others doing variations of somone else's classical compositions but it is noted that they are doing "variations" of someone else's compositions. That is ok, i think, as the original composers' names were mentioned!
If there is proof of classical composers stealing from others, i would realy like to know because i think that would be interesting to note in a thread such as this one, which has been referred to as, "the worst thread ever" by Compromised.
No one can say that in the movie, Amadeus, that Antonio Salieri really tried to do all what he appeared to be doing in the movie. Salieri is heard saying how much he adored Mozart's music. Amadeus is very much a fictional account of Mozart's life, anyway. We can't really believe much being said in there as evidence. If that was the case, King Kong really did exist, and there really was a guy named, Clark Kent who ripped off his business suit and became Superman, too.
Another poster referred to this Jimmy Page information as "ancient history". It is old news, but not every one knows about it. Many people, now, are having second thoughts even if old habits are hard to dismiss. Even for myself, i find it hard to not like those old Zep songs i grew up with and sang along with holding a hairbrush as a microphone in my bedroom miror, or the broomstick i pretended was my guitar, while pretending to be a Jimmy Page or a Jimi Hendrix. It's hard to hear the truth.
Hi-ee everyone,
Thanks for your comments.
I want to try to adress some of these comments, as best as i can, without sounding too harsh.
First of all, what really caught my eye was a couple of people saying things like, "It's ok to steal and get rich from it." Geez.
The Beatles gave credit to the original composers of the songs they covered:
This Boy, Long Tall Sally, Match Box, to name only a few of the songs covered by The Beatles. They are not guilty of any copyright infringements.
Elvis Presley was guilty, or his manager were, to large a degree, by forcing others to give Elvis half credit to songs he never even composed just so that he would sing them so he and they could make money. If they did not agree to have Elvis' name on the record, well then their songs would not be recorded by Elvis. BUT those artists did agree to do it!! It was that, or no record. That is shrewed business, but THAT was presented as such to the artists. They could have walked away saying, "no no!"
Rap artists were mentioned but check out the liner notes of those rap CD's. Credit is given to the original artists, even noting where the rap artists borrowed the samples from. Nothing is wrong with that. Credit was given, at that means those artists will receive their shares of royalties for any air-play or performances. All fine and legal and proper.
Clapton was mentioned, too, by somebody. Well, i can't be 100% sure if Clapton infringed on anyone's copyrights, but it does seem to me that he didn't, as i look at a CD i am holding in my hand, of a Cream and Yardbyrds compilation which says in the liner notes, "probably recorded in 1963". They give credit to Willie Dixon and some guy named, "Smith" for a song called, Big Boss Man. Whether or not the "Smith" mentioned, is in fact, Paul Samuel Smith of the Yardbyrds is unknown to me. However, Willie Dixon's name is mentioned and that is what i am talking about!
Stormy Monday has the name, (T. Bone) "Walker" under it. There is even a song called, Eric's Blues and that one gives credit to, Sponsor/Reklov as the composers.
The Yardbyrds gave credit to the original composers even on their biggest hits, For Your Love, which gives credit to Graham Gouldman, whoever HE is, or was. The thing to consider here is simple, now we can know who Graham Gouldman was. And he made money from that song being used. Kudos to The Yardbyrds! Another big hit by them was called, A Certain Girl , and it says, "Neville" is the composer.
Eric Clapton has been logged in history as refusing to play with anyone who didn't know who Robert Johnson was. So, I hardly think Clapton is guilty of copyright infringement.
Playing the blues, itself, does make one a thief. Discrediting others, à la Jimmy Page, does.
Someone said in this thread, "I would not know who Robert Johnson was if not for Robert Plant." Maybe he is referring to, The Lemon Song on Zep's 2nd album. Plant sings, "You can squeeze my lemon til the juice runs down my leg". No credit was given to Robert Johnson or to his song, Travelling Riverside Blues, where Plant stole those lyrics from. Maybe later, after every one had been sued, and the story was told, did he start to admit that he sang other people's lines. It still doesn't make it all better.
All of Zep's early albums' success are because many people thought Page (back then) was some kind of blues mastermind. When Zep 1 and 2 were recorded, Plant wasn't able to have his name as a songwriter due to a previous contract he signed. So, Page took most of the stolen credit, and instead of giving credit where it was due, he decided it was fair to sign himself, along with Bonham and Jones as writers. So wrong to have done that! And Page was Zeppelin's producer, so he had all creative, musical control over all Zeppelin's songs.
True enough, many of the old bluesmen in the south borrowed guitar riff's and even songs from other bluesmen of the day, but they were sure to mention, in most cases that they did. Maybe some didn't, who's to say? But 'race music' was not a billion dollar industry in the rural deep south at that time. No one was getting rich, then.
They would just travel from plantation to plantation to perform.
As far as classical composers stealing music from other classical composers. I doubt that very much. We can see classical recordings of say, Wagner, and others doing variations of somone else's classical compositions but it is noted that they are doing "variations" of someone else's compositions. That is ok, i think, as the original composers' names were mentioned!
If there is proof of classical composers stealing from others, i would realy like to know because i think that would be interesting to note in a thread such as this one, which has been referred to as, "the worst thread ever" by Compromised.
No one can say that in the movie, Amadeus, that Antonio Salieri really tried to do all what he appeared to be doing in the movie. Salieri is heard saying how much he adored Mozart's music. Amadeus is very much a fictional account of Mozart's life, anyway. We can't really believe much being said in there as evidence. If that was the case, King Kong really did exist, and there really was a guy named, Clark Kent who ripped off his business suit and became Superman, too.
Another poster referred to this Jimmy Page information as "ancient history". It is old news, but not every one knows about it. Many people, now, are having second thoughts even if old habits are hard to dismiss. Even for myself, i find it hard to not like those old Zep songs i grew up with and sang along with holding a hairbrush as a microphone in my bedroom miror, or the broomstick i pretended was my guitar, while pretending to be a Jimmy Page or a Jimi Hendrix. It's hard to hear the truth.
Last edited:
Interesting reading, indeed. (Part 2)
I will say that Page really did wonders with these old songs. Whole Lotta Love is a great tune and he did have the ability to take someone else's songs and turn them into great hits. It's just too bad and so sad that Page didn't have the decency to give credit to those who deserved the credit. Instead, he took all the glory, fame, and all the money.
Page had a lot of fame, already, being one of England's most sought after session guitarist in the 60's. Maybe, some people wanted to believe he could actually write all those great songs.
Ever hear of Randy California, before? Of course not! Did any of you know that Stairway To Heaven was very much heavily inspired by California's song called, Taurus and that there is a striking resemblance to Stairway? Of course not! Page never told you that he saw Randy California and spoke to him, asking Randy about his song Taurus. He should have, though. That would have been the right thing to do.
Breaks my heart to think that Randy California never got any recognition for that. Of course Page couldn't talk about California's Taurus - that would have only exposed what he was really doing. I can just imagine Page saying some thing like, "Randy who? Uhm...nope. Never heard of him. Excuse me, now, the arena is full and they want to hear my song, Stairway to Heaven."
California never got any money for that, nor any recognition, as far as i know. He just stayed in history as a nobody.
It's really shamefull, when you sit back and just think of it, while looking into Page's eyes in that 1966 Yardbyrds photo i posted in the very first post of this thread. You can see the look of someone who has little respect for others. Just look into his eyes - so hungry, so cut-throat. Just look at him! Out to conquer the world and step on anyone he could while doing it.
He should have been holding a pirate's skull and crossbones flag.
Page is a hypocrite, still, when he states, 40 years after the fact as he puts his hands in cement, "There are a lot of musicians out there who deserve the honour. If you started putting in all the people I think are deserving, you could cover the whole of London."
If that's the case, why doesn't he say the names of all these people he "thinks" should be mentioned, or does he really think only HIS hands are so big that only they should "cover the whole of England". I guess it's easy to claim you forget when you're 63 years old. The people he walked on don't forget though. Just read the article posted in the first post, which comes from book written about all of this. They talk to the very people who he ripped off, and those who knew him back then.
That wall, already has a stain on it.
My all-time favorite album by Zep is Houses of the Holy, by the way. That to me is the best recording they ever did, and for me that whole album stands out only because of the song called, The Song Remains The Same. When Dyer Maker came out on the radio, i thought, that's not Zeppelin - that's a sell out - I never liked it. Of course, now, i go with the flow and tap my fingers to it when i hear it, because it's been so over-played. We tend to accept many things with time.
My all time fav Led Zeppelin blues song, of course, is Since I've been Loving You from the 3rd album. All i need to hear now is that song was ripped off, too, from some unknown struggeling song writer, who was never given credit. To be honest, i wouldn't be surpirsed, at all, if he did rip it off, considering Page's thieving magpie reputation.
Page told the press, when Bonham died, "out of respect for John Bonham, Led Zeppelin couldn't carry on without Bonzo on drums".
Looking back now, it seems to me that Page thought that he carry on successfully having dissolved Led Zeppelin, never having to play those stolen tunes again. Well, guess who's back on the road, and disrepecting dear, old Bonzo's memory, AGAIN. Oh yea, you got it, "Led Ripoff"!
But to think how Page got away with what he did to so many people, for me, that just reeks of dishonesty, and cruelty. Who's to say how many unknown people's tunes he had stored away for future use. Well, time has shown, not that many, as he hasn't ever had much success after Led Zeppelin. He still has to drag Zeppelin back on the road to make money. Such a great songwriter!
I'm just wondering, does anyone know of any artists ever covering any of Jimmy Page's songs for a studio record? I'm not sure about that. Not many, i think. Maybe i'm wrong. Who would record Whole Lotta love these days and give credit to Led Zeppelin? Let me know, please.
Jimmy Page, The GREAT songwriter can't write a tune that sells these days, though. I thought songwriting was an art that gets better with time. With all his "songwriting" finesse, you'd think he'd come up with something that could sell these days, instead of being stuck forever in Led Zeppelin mode.
Page has tried to achieve success with David Coverdale, and even Paul Rogers - it all failed. There are some good tunes on that one album called, Coverdale/Page, but no groundbreaking hits though.
The Firm, with Paul Rogers, had only one only "so so" hit called, Radioactive. Still, those two bands failed. Why? With such a GREAT songwriter and riff master like Page, you'd think every thing he touched would "turn to gold".
Page maybe wrote one song way back on the Zep's 1st album. That song was called, Your Time Is Gonna Come. Well, Jimmy, as you now create a fund for street kids in Rio and get called a "do gooder", you seem to forget all the others who helped make you the famous person you are now.
You'd expect a guy like that to create a fund for struggling songwriters or something like that.
I'm gald i put his in terb, because with so many more members in this board than in the other board i am in, there are so many more opinions to consider.
It seems to me as though when Jimmy Page and Led Zeppelin said "...and as we wind on down the road - our shadows taller than our souls...", that there's more truth in those words now, than ever before. Was Robert Plant, himself, unknowingly admiting to something, in those lyrics, about how he saw himself feeling, many years in the future? He knew he was stealing other people's music back in the day.
Someone else said in this thread something like, "How could they remember who wrote what in those days with all the drugs they were doing?"
Good point! The mind can play tricks on you while under the influence of drugs. That passage quoted from Stairway to Heaven is a doozy. From what i read in magazines, they were drinking when they they worked on that song.
They always say that people tell the truth when they're drunk.
Thanks again for your comments.
Babe,
xoxo
P.S.
I'll leave you with some more irony - Jimmy Page's prophetic song from Led Zeppelin 1.
You Time Is Gonna Come
Lyin', cheatin', hurtin, that's all you seem to do.
Messin' around with every guy in town,
Puttin' me down for thinkin' of someone new.
Always the same, playin' your game,
Drive me insane, trouble's gonna come to you,
One of these days and it won't be long,
You'll look for me but baby, I'll be gone.
This is all I gotta say to you woman:
[Chorus]
Your Time Is Gonna Come [X4]
Made up my mind to break you this time,
Won't be so fine, it's my turn to cry.
Do want you want, I won't take the brunt.
It's fadin' away, can't feel you anymore.
Don't care what you say 'cause I'm goin' away to stay,
Gonna make you pay for that great big hole in my heart.
People talkin' all around,
Watch out woman, no longer
Is the joke gonna be on my heart.
You been bad to me woman,
But it's coming back home to you.
[Chorus]
P.P.S.
Could the "woman" in that song be referrenced to the music business and how Page was never credited for playing on all those hits he played on, as a session guitarist? Well, session musicians are usually never mentioned, by the way. They are paid a fee for their session time and the case is closed. Maybe that's been changed since then since more records can be sold if a great musician sits in on a session and plays. Think of Eddy Van Halen on Micheal Jackson's Beat it.
I will say that Page really did wonders with these old songs. Whole Lotta Love is a great tune and he did have the ability to take someone else's songs and turn them into great hits. It's just too bad and so sad that Page didn't have the decency to give credit to those who deserved the credit. Instead, he took all the glory, fame, and all the money.
Page had a lot of fame, already, being one of England's most sought after session guitarist in the 60's. Maybe, some people wanted to believe he could actually write all those great songs.
Ever hear of Randy California, before? Of course not! Did any of you know that Stairway To Heaven was very much heavily inspired by California's song called, Taurus and that there is a striking resemblance to Stairway? Of course not! Page never told you that he saw Randy California and spoke to him, asking Randy about his song Taurus. He should have, though. That would have been the right thing to do.
Breaks my heart to think that Randy California never got any recognition for that. Of course Page couldn't talk about California's Taurus - that would have only exposed what he was really doing. I can just imagine Page saying some thing like, "Randy who? Uhm...nope. Never heard of him. Excuse me, now, the arena is full and they want to hear my song, Stairway to Heaven."
California never got any money for that, nor any recognition, as far as i know. He just stayed in history as a nobody.
It's really shamefull, when you sit back and just think of it, while looking into Page's eyes in that 1966 Yardbyrds photo i posted in the very first post of this thread. You can see the look of someone who has little respect for others. Just look into his eyes - so hungry, so cut-throat. Just look at him! Out to conquer the world and step on anyone he could while doing it.
He should have been holding a pirate's skull and crossbones flag.
Page is a hypocrite, still, when he states, 40 years after the fact as he puts his hands in cement, "There are a lot of musicians out there who deserve the honour. If you started putting in all the people I think are deserving, you could cover the whole of London."
If that's the case, why doesn't he say the names of all these people he "thinks" should be mentioned, or does he really think only HIS hands are so big that only they should "cover the whole of England". I guess it's easy to claim you forget when you're 63 years old. The people he walked on don't forget though. Just read the article posted in the first post, which comes from book written about all of this. They talk to the very people who he ripped off, and those who knew him back then.
That wall, already has a stain on it.
My all-time favorite album by Zep is Houses of the Holy, by the way. That to me is the best recording they ever did, and for me that whole album stands out only because of the song called, The Song Remains The Same. When Dyer Maker came out on the radio, i thought, that's not Zeppelin - that's a sell out - I never liked it. Of course, now, i go with the flow and tap my fingers to it when i hear it, because it's been so over-played. We tend to accept many things with time.
My all time fav Led Zeppelin blues song, of course, is Since I've been Loving You from the 3rd album. All i need to hear now is that song was ripped off, too, from some unknown struggeling song writer, who was never given credit. To be honest, i wouldn't be surpirsed, at all, if he did rip it off, considering Page's thieving magpie reputation.
Page told the press, when Bonham died, "out of respect for John Bonham, Led Zeppelin couldn't carry on without Bonzo on drums".
Looking back now, it seems to me that Page thought that he carry on successfully having dissolved Led Zeppelin, never having to play those stolen tunes again. Well, guess who's back on the road, and disrepecting dear, old Bonzo's memory, AGAIN. Oh yea, you got it, "Led Ripoff"!
But to think how Page got away with what he did to so many people, for me, that just reeks of dishonesty, and cruelty. Who's to say how many unknown people's tunes he had stored away for future use. Well, time has shown, not that many, as he hasn't ever had much success after Led Zeppelin. He still has to drag Zeppelin back on the road to make money. Such a great songwriter!
I'm just wondering, does anyone know of any artists ever covering any of Jimmy Page's songs for a studio record? I'm not sure about that. Not many, i think. Maybe i'm wrong. Who would record Whole Lotta love these days and give credit to Led Zeppelin? Let me know, please.
Jimmy Page, The GREAT songwriter can't write a tune that sells these days, though. I thought songwriting was an art that gets better with time. With all his "songwriting" finesse, you'd think he'd come up with something that could sell these days, instead of being stuck forever in Led Zeppelin mode.
Page has tried to achieve success with David Coverdale, and even Paul Rogers - it all failed. There are some good tunes on that one album called, Coverdale/Page, but no groundbreaking hits though.
The Firm, with Paul Rogers, had only one only "so so" hit called, Radioactive. Still, those two bands failed. Why? With such a GREAT songwriter and riff master like Page, you'd think every thing he touched would "turn to gold".
Page maybe wrote one song way back on the Zep's 1st album. That song was called, Your Time Is Gonna Come. Well, Jimmy, as you now create a fund for street kids in Rio and get called a "do gooder", you seem to forget all the others who helped make you the famous person you are now.
You'd expect a guy like that to create a fund for struggling songwriters or something like that.
I'm gald i put his in terb, because with so many more members in this board than in the other board i am in, there are so many more opinions to consider.
It seems to me as though when Jimmy Page and Led Zeppelin said "...and as we wind on down the road - our shadows taller than our souls...", that there's more truth in those words now, than ever before. Was Robert Plant, himself, unknowingly admiting to something, in those lyrics, about how he saw himself feeling, many years in the future? He knew he was stealing other people's music back in the day.
Someone else said in this thread something like, "How could they remember who wrote what in those days with all the drugs they were doing?"
Good point! The mind can play tricks on you while under the influence of drugs. That passage quoted from Stairway to Heaven is a doozy. From what i read in magazines, they were drinking when they they worked on that song.
They always say that people tell the truth when they're drunk.
Thanks again for your comments.
Babe,
xoxo
P.S.
I'll leave you with some more irony - Jimmy Page's prophetic song from Led Zeppelin 1.
You Time Is Gonna Come
Lyin', cheatin', hurtin, that's all you seem to do.
Messin' around with every guy in town,
Puttin' me down for thinkin' of someone new.
Always the same, playin' your game,
Drive me insane, trouble's gonna come to you,
One of these days and it won't be long,
You'll look for me but baby, I'll be gone.
This is all I gotta say to you woman:
[Chorus]
Your Time Is Gonna Come [X4]
Made up my mind to break you this time,
Won't be so fine, it's my turn to cry.
Do want you want, I won't take the brunt.
It's fadin' away, can't feel you anymore.
Don't care what you say 'cause I'm goin' away to stay,
Gonna make you pay for that great big hole in my heart.
People talkin' all around,
Watch out woman, no longer
Is the joke gonna be on my heart.
You been bad to me woman,
But it's coming back home to you.
[Chorus]
P.P.S.
Could the "woman" in that song be referrenced to the music business and how Page was never credited for playing on all those hits he played on, as a session guitarist? Well, session musicians are usually never mentioned, by the way. They are paid a fee for their session time and the case is closed. Maybe that's been changed since then since more records can be sold if a great musician sits in on a session and plays. Think of Eddy Van Halen on Micheal Jackson's Beat it.
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Well, all the blues guys borrowed from all the blues guys,,,,
Read the Lemon song story ...
Killing floor is a cool version BTW , also as previously stated ... If it was blatent enuff for a lawyer to get a piece of it..... they usually did ..Howlin wolf got a piece of the Lemon, Johnston never did ..
SO don't blame Jimmy , blame Johnstons poor lawer !
The song borrows significantly from Howlin' Wolf's "Killing Floor", which was a song Led Zeppelin often incorporated into their live setlist during their first concert tour of the United States. For the second and third North American tours the song evolved into "The Lemon Song", with Plant often improvising lyrics onstage. However, despite Howlin' Wolf's influence on the arrangement, the album sleeve of Led Zeppelin II initially credited only the four members of Led Zeppelin. The band was later sued for copyright infringement, and Howlin' Wolf's name was added to the credits.Other lyrics, notably "squeeze (my lemon) 'til the juice runs down my leg," can be traced to Robert Johnson's "Traveling Riverside Blues". It is likely that Johnson borrowed this himself, from a song recorded in the same year (1937) called "She Squeezed My Lemon" (by Arthur McKay).[1] Robert Johnson's name has never been added to the credits for "The Lemon Song".
Read the Lemon song story ...
Killing floor is a cool version BTW , also as previously stated ... If it was blatent enuff for a lawyer to get a piece of it..... they usually did ..Howlin wolf got a piece of the Lemon, Johnston never did ..
SO don't blame Jimmy , blame Johnstons poor lawer !
The song borrows significantly from Howlin' Wolf's "Killing Floor", which was a song Led Zeppelin often incorporated into their live setlist during their first concert tour of the United States. For the second and third North American tours the song evolved into "The Lemon Song", with Plant often improvising lyrics onstage. However, despite Howlin' Wolf's influence on the arrangement, the album sleeve of Led Zeppelin II initially credited only the four members of Led Zeppelin. The band was later sued for copyright infringement, and Howlin' Wolf's name was added to the credits.Other lyrics, notably "squeeze (my lemon) 'til the juice runs down my leg," can be traced to Robert Johnson's "Traveling Riverside Blues". It is likely that Johnson borrowed this himself, from a song recorded in the same year (1937) called "She Squeezed My Lemon" (by Arthur McKay).[1] Robert Johnson's name has never been added to the credits for "The Lemon Song".
No one's arguing that Page always gave proper credit, but you're exaggerating it way out of proportion. 90% of Zeppelin's music is completely original, the other 10% are ideas and lyrics that Zeppelin greatly improved upon. The Stones and Beatles are just as guilty. Like Zeppelin, they gave credit on some songs they covered but outright stole others. Even most of the examples you give are faulty. To call Communication Breakdown a ripoff of Nervous Breakdown is ignorant. By your logic, the Stones 19th Nervous Breakdown would also be stolen. Even if you accept that Stairway to Heaven stole the opening chords, ask yourself why no other band was able to turn it into the most popular song of all time.
The violin bow.
Hi-ee again,
Just another "musical note" on the "Page."
Playing guitar with a violin bow was not Page's innovation. There were a few before him who did it first.
(Wink)
Babe,
xoxo
Hi-ee again,
Just another "musical note" on the "Page."
Playing guitar with a violin bow was not Page's innovation. There were a few before him who did it first.
(Wink)
Babe,
xoxo
I know!
All i am considering here is how Page got fame and recognition by using other people's ideas. Page is a great guitarist. I never said he wasn't a great guitarist.
I did say Page had the abilty to make other people's songs great hits. HE COULD have at least said something and gave some credit to Randy California, though. That was really the song that made them as big as they became. Like it would have broke Page's heart to mention Califorina's name.
It's just wrong, admit it!
If not for Taurus, we would never be singing Stairway to Heaven, and that is what i think you are all missing here.
I am talking about giving others the credit they deserve, sharing the fame and the wealth. Page never did that. After hearing Zep's 3rd album, people sort of thought, "Huh? What's all this acoustic stuff coming from the mighty blues band?"
Zep's 4th album REALLY made them famous and that was in a large degree only because of Stairway to Heaven, a song that never would have been without Taurus. Face that fact, please.
And no! The Beatles are not guilty of copyright infringement. Find a song by The Beatles which shows copyright infringment, please, before accusing them. The Stones are guilty for some, yes, most definately. Not the Beatles.
As far as communication breakdown goes, i listened to the Cochran song. I wrote what i felt, i heard a familiarity to it, not much. It was said that it was a re-write, not a ripoff. I never said Zep ripped it off. I did say, that Cochran's name should have been mentioned.
Have you even listened to the youtube songs i included? I am not making all this up.
Babe,
xoxo
Hi-ee,Fritz96 said:
All i am considering here is how Page got fame and recognition by using other people's ideas. Page is a great guitarist. I never said he wasn't a great guitarist.
I did say Page had the abilty to make other people's songs great hits. HE COULD have at least said something and gave some credit to Randy California, though. That was really the song that made them as big as they became. Like it would have broke Page's heart to mention Califorina's name.
It's just wrong, admit it!
If not for Taurus, we would never be singing Stairway to Heaven, and that is what i think you are all missing here.
I am talking about giving others the credit they deserve, sharing the fame and the wealth. Page never did that. After hearing Zep's 3rd album, people sort of thought, "Huh? What's all this acoustic stuff coming from the mighty blues band?"
Zep's 4th album REALLY made them famous and that was in a large degree only because of Stairway to Heaven, a song that never would have been without Taurus. Face that fact, please.
And no! The Beatles are not guilty of copyright infringement. Find a song by The Beatles which shows copyright infringment, please, before accusing them. The Stones are guilty for some, yes, most definately. Not the Beatles.
As far as communication breakdown goes, i listened to the Cochran song. I wrote what i felt, i heard a familiarity to it, not much. It was said that it was a re-write, not a ripoff. I never said Zep ripped it off. I did say, that Cochran's name should have been mentioned.
Have you even listened to the youtube songs i included? I am not making all this up.
Babe,
xoxo
Actually, the rumour is that Page asked if he could borrow the opening chord for Stairway to Heaven. Why do you think he's wasn't sued, considering it's the most popular song of all time? Even without STH, Zeppelin would have been the top selling rock band. If anything it overshadowed their other work. Here are a few tracks the Beatles stole.
"My Sweet Lord" - ripoff of "He's So Fine"
"Come Together" - the first two lines are adapted from Chuck Berry's "You Can't Catch Me."
"Fixing A Hole" - Mal Evans cowrote the song with Paul, but took a one-time payment rather than a songwriting credit. Not plagiarism, because Evans was a willing party to the arrangement, but it sure is weird.
"Free As A Bird" - when the Threetles revived this 1977 Lennon demo in 1995, they added a middle section. Unfortunately, they added the middle section from the 1964 Shangri-Las hit "Remember (Walkin' In The Sand)."
"Golden Slumbers" - lyrics adapted from a 17th Century poem by Thomas Dekker.
"I Feel Fine" - main guitar line borrowed from Bobby Parker's "Watch Your Step."
"Run For Your Life" - first line comes from "Baby Let's Play House" as recorded by Elvis Presley.
"Something" - first line is the title of a song by then-Apple recording artist James Taylor
"The Inner Light" - lyrics were lifted, uncredited, from the Tao Te Ching.
"My Sweet Lord" - ripoff of "He's So Fine"
"Come Together" - the first two lines are adapted from Chuck Berry's "You Can't Catch Me."
"Fixing A Hole" - Mal Evans cowrote the song with Paul, but took a one-time payment rather than a songwriting credit. Not plagiarism, because Evans was a willing party to the arrangement, but it sure is weird.
"Free As A Bird" - when the Threetles revived this 1977 Lennon demo in 1995, they added a middle section. Unfortunately, they added the middle section from the 1964 Shangri-Las hit "Remember (Walkin' In The Sand)."
"Golden Slumbers" - lyrics adapted from a 17th Century poem by Thomas Dekker.
"I Feel Fine" - main guitar line borrowed from Bobby Parker's "Watch Your Step."
"Run For Your Life" - first line comes from "Baby Let's Play House" as recorded by Elvis Presley.
"Something" - first line is the title of a song by then-Apple recording artist James Taylor
"The Inner Light" - lyrics were lifted, uncredited, from the Tao Te Ching.
If they did wrong then they are wrong!
Hi-ee
Well, that's cool to know. Thanks. Are you sure they became rip roaring famous because of it? The way Zep did? You did mention that Malcolm Evans was willing, so, that is not a rip off per se. He agreed, if he agreed.
I already mentioned Elvis's doings, in another post.
Another group called, The Bryds, in their song, "Turn, Turn, Turn," i think is the title, took the words straight from the Bible. Who are they supposed to give credit to, Jesus Christ, himself?
Same idea with the Tao Te Ching, who should be written as the co-author, Buddha or whoever?
For the other songs you mentioned, you might be right, if there was no mention of it on the records credits.
Page became famous from what he did. George Harrison made a mistake i think, i don't really think he did it on purpose. The Beatles' early hits were all given credit to the original composer. Just do a google search for Beatle song lyrics and see the many songs they did not write having the original composers name beside the titles.
A main guitar line, hmm, that's good point. Don't ask me why, though.
I don't write the laws. And i don't know everything, either.
But i do know Page was a major culprit of this sort of thing, and there is documents for proof, right here in this thread, and said proof was not made up by me.
Thanks, though. I really do appreciate the input.
I am glad i put this thread in terb, so many cool responses. It's great!
Babe,
xoxo
Fritz96 said:
Hi-ee
Well, that's cool to know. Thanks. Are you sure they became rip roaring famous because of it? The way Zep did? You did mention that Malcolm Evans was willing, so, that is not a rip off per se. He agreed, if he agreed.
I already mentioned Elvis's doings, in another post.
Another group called, The Bryds, in their song, "Turn, Turn, Turn," i think is the title, took the words straight from the Bible. Who are they supposed to give credit to, Jesus Christ, himself?
Same idea with the Tao Te Ching, who should be written as the co-author, Buddha or whoever?
For the other songs you mentioned, you might be right, if there was no mention of it on the records credits.
Page became famous from what he did. George Harrison made a mistake i think, i don't really think he did it on purpose. The Beatles' early hits were all given credit to the original composer. Just do a google search for Beatle song lyrics and see the many songs they did not write having the original composers name beside the titles.
A main guitar line, hmm, that's good point. Don't ask me why, though.
I don't write the laws. And i don't know everything, either.
But i do know Page was a major culprit of this sort of thing, and there is documents for proof, right here in this thread, and said proof was not made up by me.
Thanks, though. I really do appreciate the input.
I am glad i put this thread in terb, so many cool responses. It's great!
Babe,
xoxo
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Let's compare two you mentioned.
I bought a brand-new air-mobile
It custom-made, 'twas a Flight De Ville
With a pow'ful motor and some hideaway wings
Push in on the button and you can hear her sing
CHORUS:
Now you can't catch me, baby you can't catch me
'Cause if you get too close, you know I'm gone like a cool breeze
New Jersey Turnpike in the wee wee hours
I was rollin' slowly 'cause of drizzlin' showers
Here come a flat-top, he was movin' up with me
Then come wavin' by me in a little' old souped-up jitney
I put my foot on my tank and I began to roll
Moanin' siren, 'twas the state patrol
So I let out my wings and then I blew my horn
Bye bye New Jersey, I've become airborne
(chorus)
Flyin' with my baby last Saturday night
Not a gray cloud floatin' in sight
Big full moon shinin' up above
Cuddle up honey, be my love
Sweetest little thing I've ever seen
I'm gonna name you Maybellene
Flyin' on the beam, set on flight control
Radio tuned to rock 'n' roll
Two, three hours passed us by
Five to two dropped to 5:05
Fuel consumption way too fast
Let's get on home before we run out of gas
Come Together - The Beatles
Here come old flattop, he come grooving up slowly
He got joo-joo eyeball, he one holy roller
He got hair down to his knee
Got to be a joker he just do what he please
He wear no shoeshine, he got toe-jam football
He got monkey finger, he shoot coca-cola
He say "I know you, you know me"
One thing I can tell you is you got to be free
Come together right now over me
He bag production, he got walrus gumboot
He got Ono sideboard, he one spinal cracker
He got feet down below his knee
Hold you in his armchair you can feel his disease
Come together right now over me
[Right!
Come, oh, come, come, come.]
He roller-coaster, he got early warning
He got muddy water, he one mojo filter
He say "One and one and one is three"
Got to be good-looking cos he's so hard to see
Come together right now over me
Oh
Come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah oh
Come together
Yeah come together
You Can't Catch Me - Chuck BerryFritz96 said:
I bought a brand-new air-mobile
It custom-made, 'twas a Flight De Ville
With a pow'ful motor and some hideaway wings
Push in on the button and you can hear her sing
CHORUS:
Now you can't catch me, baby you can't catch me
'Cause if you get too close, you know I'm gone like a cool breeze
New Jersey Turnpike in the wee wee hours
I was rollin' slowly 'cause of drizzlin' showers
Here come a flat-top, he was movin' up with me
Then come wavin' by me in a little' old souped-up jitney
I put my foot on my tank and I began to roll
Moanin' siren, 'twas the state patrol
So I let out my wings and then I blew my horn
Bye bye New Jersey, I've become airborne
(chorus)
Flyin' with my baby last Saturday night
Not a gray cloud floatin' in sight
Big full moon shinin' up above
Cuddle up honey, be my love
Sweetest little thing I've ever seen
I'm gonna name you Maybellene
Flyin' on the beam, set on flight control
Radio tuned to rock 'n' roll
Two, three hours passed us by
Five to two dropped to 5:05
Fuel consumption way too fast
Let's get on home before we run out of gas
Come Together - The Beatles
Here come old flattop, he come grooving up slowly
He got joo-joo eyeball, he one holy roller
He got hair down to his knee
Got to be a joker he just do what he please
He wear no shoeshine, he got toe-jam football
He got monkey finger, he shoot coca-cola
He say "I know you, you know me"
One thing I can tell you is you got to be free
Come together right now over me
He bag production, he got walrus gumboot
He got Ono sideboard, he one spinal cracker
He got feet down below his knee
Hold you in his armchair you can feel his disease
Come together right now over me
[Right!
Come, oh, come, come, come.]
He roller-coaster, he got early warning
He got muddy water, he one mojo filter
He say "One and one and one is three"
Got to be good-looking cos he's so hard to see
Come together right now over me
Oh
Come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah come together
Yeah oh
Come together
Yeah come together
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Public Domain
Some things are allowed, as they are considered to be Public Domain material. So, maybe using a 17th century poem may not be really considered a rip off. I may be wrong.
Babe,
xoxo
Hi-ee,Fritz96 said:
Some things are allowed, as they are considered to be Public Domain material. So, maybe using a 17th century poem may not be really considered a rip off. I may be wrong.
Babe,
xoxo
Last edited:
Here are two others you mentioned.
Theres something in the way she moves,
Or looks my way, or calls my name,
That seems to leave this troubled world behind.
If Im feeling down and blue,
Or troubled by some foolish game,
She always seems to make me change my mind.
Chorus:
n(and) I feel fine anytime shes around me now,
Shes around me now
Almost all the time.
n(and) if Im well you can tell that shes been with me now,
n(and) shes been with me now
Quite a long, long time
And I feel fine.___________
Every now and then the things I lean on lose their meaning,
And I find myself careening
Into places where I should not let me go.
-- she has the power to go where no one else can find me,
Yes, and to silently remind me
Of the happiness and good times that I know, you know.
Well I said I just got to know that:
It isnt what shes got to say
Or how she thinks or where shes been.
To me, the words are nice, the way they sound.
I like to hear them best that way -
It doesnt much matter what they mean,
Weh (when/well? ) she says them mostly just to calm me down.
Chorus:
n(and) I feel fine anytime shes around me now,
A-shes around me now
Almost all the time.
If Im well you can tell that shes been with me now,
And shes been with me now
Quite a long,
Long
Time -
Yes, and I feel fine.___________
Beatles - Something
Something in the way she moves
Attracts me like no other lover
Something in the way she woos me
I don't want to leave her now
You know I believe her now
Somewhere in her smile she knows
That I don't need no other lover
Something in her style that shows me
Don't want to leave her now
You know I believe her now
You're asking me will my love grow
I don't know, I don't know
You stick around now it may show
I don't know, I don't know
Something in the way she knows
And all I have to do is think of her
Something in the things she shows me
Don't want to leave her now
You know I believe her now
James Taylor - Something in the way she movesFritz96 said:
Theres something in the way she moves,
Or looks my way, or calls my name,
That seems to leave this troubled world behind.
If Im feeling down and blue,
Or troubled by some foolish game,
She always seems to make me change my mind.
Chorus:
n(and) I feel fine anytime shes around me now,
Shes around me now
Almost all the time.
n(and) if Im well you can tell that shes been with me now,
n(and) shes been with me now
Quite a long, long time
And I feel fine.___________
Every now and then the things I lean on lose their meaning,
And I find myself careening
Into places where I should not let me go.
-- she has the power to go where no one else can find me,
Yes, and to silently remind me
Of the happiness and good times that I know, you know.
Well I said I just got to know that:
It isnt what shes got to say
Or how she thinks or where shes been.
To me, the words are nice, the way they sound.
I like to hear them best that way -
It doesnt much matter what they mean,
Weh (when/well? ) she says them mostly just to calm me down.
Chorus:
n(and) I feel fine anytime shes around me now,
A-shes around me now
Almost all the time.
If Im well you can tell that shes been with me now,
And shes been with me now
Quite a long,
Long
Time -
Yes, and I feel fine.___________
Beatles - Something
Something in the way she moves
Attracts me like no other lover
Something in the way she woos me
I don't want to leave her now
You know I believe her now
Somewhere in her smile she knows
That I don't need no other lover
Something in her style that shows me
Don't want to leave her now
You know I believe her now
You're asking me will my love grow
I don't know, I don't know
You stick around now it may show
I don't know, I don't know
Something in the way she knows
And all I have to do is think of her
Something in the things she shows me
Don't want to leave her now
You know I believe her now
Last edited:
