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Jerusalem decision will precipitate greater chaos.

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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Backing Israel as 'Jewish' state is like backing the Iranian theocracy of the Saudi theocracy.
I don't think you know what the word "theocracy" means.

Regardless, it's clear that even you don't seriously believe Saudi Arabia and Egypt and others are so committed to your arguments about "democracy" that they're going to risk everything by supporting the so-called "refugees" taking charge of Israel.

Israel is and will remain a Jewish state. That's reality.

If the Palestinians want their own sovereign state, they're going to have to accept that reality. The only alternative is the status quo.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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I don't think you know what the word "theocracy" means.

Regardless, it's clear that even you don't seriously believe Saudi Arabia and Egypt and others are so committed to your arguments about "democracy" that they're going to risk everything by supporting the so-called "refugees" taking charge of Israel.

Israel is and will remain a Jewish state. That's reality.

If the Palestinians want their own sovereign state, they're going to have to accept that reality. The only alternative is the status quo.
The status quo is apartheid.
Phil supports it, sounds like you do as well.

Saudi is close to a theocracy, Egypt is really just run by a despot, if you want to be accurate.
Israel, you could call it an ethno state or a theocracy, probably ethno state is more accurate.

Israel was warned by two ex-PM's that they risk turning into a pariah apartheid state without the two state solution.
And really, only Israel can pull the trigger, since they are the ones with the nukes, drones and missiles.
The Palestinians are prisoners, they have no pull on the situation.

History says that boycotts can end apartheid peacefully, lets hope that's the way it happens again.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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The Palestinians are prisoners, they have no pull on the situation.
Now you've just gone back to total bullshitting.

In reality, the Palestinians were offered sovereign statehood three different times. They were also given a tremendous opportunity and the resources to create their own economic prosperity in the Gaza strip.

Nothing worked because of the Palestinian leaders' myopic focus on Jew hatred.

Instead of daydreaming about boycotts, deal with reality. The Palestinians are being abandoned by the world, including by their fellow Arabs, because they can't get past their Jew hatred.

They continue -- to this day -- to be offered opportunities to change the situation. They have two choices:

1) Endorse Israel's status as a Jewish nation and negotiate a two-state solution.

2) Status quo.

By continuously rejecting the first option, the Palestinians remain stuck with the second one. It is only when they accept the reality that Israel is a Jewish state that they'll make any progress.

The only thing keeping them "prisoners" in their current condition is their Jew hatred. They need to get over it.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
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Nothing worked because of the Palestinian leaders' myopic focus on Jew hatred.
That's just your Palestinian hatred speaking, claiming that the problem are the attitudes of those living under brutal military occupation and apartheid.
As if all they needed to do was to hand over all the cutlery, bend over for some free anal probes and vow subservience to their superior overlords.

The reality is nothing the Palestinians think would change the goals of the zionist movement to take over all of Palestine, as they are still working on today, settlement by settlement.

But now you're stuck with apartheid, and once the ICC rules Israel will become less popular then South Africa during apartheid, since they've knowingly put themselves into the position of extreme pariah state.

Just end apartheid and give them equal rights.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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That's just your Palestinian hatred speaking, claiming that the problem are the attitudes of those....
Jew hatred is an "attitude"? Hmm.

In any event, the Palestinians do bear the responsibility for their repeated rejection of sovereign statehood. Generous offers have been made but the Palestinians never manage to reach an agreement.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
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(O)nce the ICC rules Israel will become less popular then South Africa during apartheid, since they've knowingly put themselves into the position of extreme pariah state.
You're still peddling the fairy tale that the world is going to support Iran's ambitions by helping the ineffective "refugees" to take control of Israel. Ain't gonna happen.

You would be well advised to read this opinion piece that appeared in the Jerusalem Post the other day. It addresses the issues we're debating and reasonably asks when the Palestinians are going to stop settling for emotional victories and actually attempt to achieve meaningful results.

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/What-is-the-objective-of-the-Palestinian-Arabs-542241

The entire article is worth reading, but here's one of the quotes that gets at the point.

If they wish to wait until Israel disappears or becomes significantly weaker, then many more generations of Palestinian Arabs will continue to cheer, applaud and announce that the gates of hell are going to open as Israelis prosper and become even more powerful and successful.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
59,732
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Except the Palestinian Constitution that Abbas oversaw EXPLICITLY states Palestine is and Islamic State ruled on the principles of Sharia and your Hamas heroes state the same.

You are a complete fraud.
Hmm. Franky has no comment. What a surprise.

p.s. I wonder if he'll admit that Hamas means ISLAMIC Resistance Movement or that Fatah is a term used to describe the Islamic conquest of the region?
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
59,732
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...
The reality is nothing the Palestinians think would change the goals of....
Except actually accepting the idea of peace and rejecting their terrorism and hatred.

Of course Hamas being violently opposed to having equal rights with Jews never enters into your thinking.
 

wigglee

Well-known member
Oct 13, 2010
9,819
1,603
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Jew hatred is an "attitude"? Hmm.

In any event, the Palestinians do bear the responsibility for their repeated rejection of sovereign statehood. Generous offers have been made but the Palestinians never manage to reach an agreement.
Is this Palestinian hatred or a kind offer to reduce their schools to rubble? Here's a heart warming story for all you Terb JDL'ers...
http://daysofpalestine.com/post/10835
 

jsanchez

Well-known member
Apr 8, 2004
2,524
1,586
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T.O.
...
Israel was warned by two ex-PM's that they risk turning into a pariah apartheid state without the two state solution.
And really, only Israel can pull the trigger, since they are the ones with the nukes, drones and missiles.
The Palestinians are prisoners, they have no pull on the situation.
...
A one state solution would result in perpetual troubles for Israel. Guess why Jordan and Egypt want nothing to do with the West bank and Gaza respectively.

You're wrong though when you state the Palestinians have no pull, they do, but they've always been divided into factions and sub-factions that served the interests of external masters.
What they've needed the most but never had was a pragmatic/courageous leadership willing to confront them with the hard truths instead of repeating endless slogans.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
79,716
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You're still peddling the fairy tale that the world is going to support Iran's ambitions by helping the ineffective "refugees" to take control of Israel. Ain't gonna happen.

You would be well advised to read this opinion piece that appeared in the Jerusalem Post the other day. It addresses the issues we're debating and reasonably asks when the Palestinians are going to stop settling for emotional victories and actually attempt to achieve meaningful results.

http://www.jpost.com/Opinion/What-is-the-objective-of-the-Palestinian-Arabs-542241

The entire article is worth reading, but here's one of the quotes that gets at the point.
That's just an angry rant, where the author tries to blame Palestinians for being occupied by a nuclear army.

But if you're talking endgames you have to admit that the zionist movement endgame appears to be incredibly stupid.
Now they've taken over too much of Palestine for there to ever be a two state solution, so they're stuck with apartheid.
And apartheid won't fly in this day and age.
They have all the weapons but they're really screwing themselves over.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
79,716
17,562
113
A one state solution would result in perpetual troubles for Israel. Guess why Jordan and Egypt want nothing to do with the West bank and Gaza respectively.

You're wrong though when you state the Palestinians have no pull, they do, but they've always been divided into factions and sub-factions that served the interests of external masters.
What they've needed the most but never had was a pragmatic/courageous leadership willing to confront them with the hard truths instead of repeating endless slogans.
They do have a good leader, Barghouti, but Israel has kept him in prison and propped up Abbas, who has helped stop Palestinian protests and actions.
And yes, Israel has also made use of the Hamas/Fatah divide to play sides against each other.

But really, look at Oslo. The 'peace talks' were just used as a stalling technique while Israel put half a million 'settlers' in Palestine to claim that land for 'land swaps'.

Israel has done exactly as they've wanted and what they did was create an apartheid state and kill the two state solution.
So stupid.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
10,489
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That's just an angry rant....
Try reading it again. It actually makes an excellent point -- one you would do well to learn.

The Palestinian leaders might think they're scoring "emotional" victories but in terms of real-world results, they have achieved absolutely nothing.

Blaming others is no solution. At some point, they have to get past their Jew hatred and their never-ending portrayal of themselves as "refugees" and actually try to accomplish something for their people.

Certainly, they have had plenty of opportunities -- and blown all of them.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
59,732
6,288
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Except the Palestinian Constitution that Abbas oversaw EXPLICITLY states Palestine is and Islamic State ruled on the principles of Sharia and your Hamas heroes state the same.

You are a complete fraud.
And fraudfooter still refuses to criticize the Palestinians for being explicitly Islamic despite all his criticism about Israel.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
59,732
6,288
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That's just an angry rant, where the author tries to blame Palestinians for being occupied by a nuclear army.

But if you're talking endgames you have to admit that the zionist movement endgame appears to be incredibly stupid.
Now they've taken over too much of Palestine for there to ever be a two state solution, so they're stuck with apartheid.
And apartheid won't fly in this day and age.
They have all the weapons but they're really screwing themselves over.
Just another rambling post where you once again refuse to hold Palestinians accountable for their actions and 100 years of rejecting peace.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
59,732
6,288
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They do have a good leader, Barghouti, but Israel has kept him in prison ....
That's what countries tend to do with terrorists convicted of multiple murderers.

But of course you want to pretend he's in jail for his political views.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
59,732
6,288
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I'm sure Israel would be so much more successful if it were run by the "refugees."

Frickin' hilarious.
Actually Israel is run by refugees, pretty equal numbers chased from Europe and Arab lands. Difference is those refugees have focussed on building a country instead of destroying one.
 
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