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Thread: The Impeachment Case Against Trump Just Got a Hell of a Lot Stronger

  1. #1

    The Impeachment Case Against Trump Just Got a Hell of a Lot Stronger

    The Impeachment Case Against Trump Just Got a Hell of a Lot Stronger

    The revelation that Trump was briefed on the whistleblower’s complaint in late August blows up another GOP defense.

    By Cameron Joseph

    Nov 27 2019, 3:08pm

    WASHINGTON — Welp, there goes another GOP impeachment defense.

    President Trump was briefed on the whistleblower complaint against him weeks before he decided to release military aid to Ukraine, the New York Times reported Tuesday, news that undercuts one of the Republicans' central impeachment defenses.

    Republicans have claimed throughout the process that there was no “quid pro quo” because Trump eventually released the money to Ukraine without getting anything in return.

    That was already a flimsy claim; Trump didn’t release the money until Sept. 11, two days after House Democrats launched a public investigation into the matter and only one day before the House voted to begin what would turn into the impeachment inquiry. And the news suggests Trump kept pushing to extort Ukraine even after he knew people within his administration were raising alarms about his actions.

    Other new details paint a picture of inter-agency confusion and unrest over Trump’s move to withhold military aid from Ukraine.

    Transcripts released by the House Intelligence Committee Tuesday show that officials at the Office of Management and Budget were kept in the dark for months about why that money was withheld, and that the $390 million in aid was officially blocked on July 25, the same day of Trump’s infamous call with Ukraine’s President Zelensky.

    What Trump knew and why it matters

    The revelation that Trump was briefed on the whistleblower’s complaint in late August makes his subsequent actions even more problematic.

    Trump knew that a whistleblower had raised the alarm about why the aid was withheld for weeks before he released it. Even more troubling: Trump knew of the whistleblower complaint days before U.S. Ambassador to the European Union Gordon Sondland explicitly told Ukrainian officials on Sept. 1 that they wouldn’t get the aid unless they announced they were conducting investigations into Trump’s political rivals. Sondland has testified that he assumed that’s what Trump wanted, though he’s claimed he wasn't explicitly told by the president that was the demand.

    We already knew that Trump’s attorneys knew of the whistleblower complaint in August, but this is the first time it’s been definitively reported that Trump himself was informed about the complaint. And according to the Times, the White House was still trying to keep Congress from finding about it during this key stretch, even as Trump officials kept pushing Ukraine to announce investigations into Biden and the 2016 election.

    The new information also sheds light on Trump’s alleged word choice on a Sept. 9 call with Sondland. When Acting U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine Bill Taylor texted Sondland that day saying "I think it's crazy to withhold security assistance for help with a political campaign," Sondland followed up hours later with a text saying Trump “has been crystal-clear no quid pro quos of any kind.”

    Sondland testified that text came after he had a phone call where Trump explicitly denied a “quid pro quo,” a phrase, as the Times points out, that wasn’t yet in the public lexicon. On that call, Sondland testified, Trump said he wanted Zelensky to “do the right thing” — e.g., to announce the investigations into 2016 and the Bidens that Trump and his allies had been demanding.

    It’s been clear for some time, based on multiple witnesses’ testimony, that Trump sought to extort Ukraine for his political ends. But this makes it clear that even when they knew a whistleblower was attempting to sound the alarm about what they were doing, the Trump administration persisted in its pressure campaign.

    Administration officials’ alarm

    The timing of the whistleblower complaint isn’t the only evidence that bolsters the case against Trump.

    Mark Sandy, a top official at the Office of Management and Budget, testified that he wasn’t told that Ukraine aid was being held up because of concerns other countries weren’t doing enough to help Ukraine, another talking point used to defend the president. He said the first time he'd heard that argument was in early September, as the White House retroactively sought to come up with a plausible justification for why the aid was withheld and asked him to pull together data on what European countries had given to Ukraine.

    Until then, Sandy said, it was “an open question” within OMB why the money had been held up, one he’d been unable to get answered by the White House. He said some career staff warned that the hold was illegal because the executive branch is required to spend money that Congress has appropriated. And he said that two officials were so frustrated with the hold on aid that they resigned.

    Sandy testified that Trump first asked OMB about why Ukraine was getting U.S. military aid after seeing a “media report” about it in late June. Sandy first found out the aid would be held up on July 12, six days before it became widely known within the administration. But he testified that the White House didn’t officially block aid to Ukraine until July 25, the exact same day of Trump’s phone call with President Zelensky, where he asked the leader to “do us a favor” and invoked Biden and 2016.

    A transcript of Sandy's testimony was released by the House Intelligence Committee on Tuesday evening.

    https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/8...a-lot-stronger

  2. #2
    Trump has been invited to go to the impeachment hearings.
    Think he will?
    Donít be a tough guy. Donít be a fool! I will call you later

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Frankfooter View Post
    Trump has been invited to go to the impeachment hearings.
    Think he will?
    Let's hope so

  4. #4
    Never Been Justly Banned
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    Yet another smoking gun?


    At the bottom of all the tributes paid to democracy, is the little man, walking into the little booth, with a little pencil, making a little cross on a little bit of paper - no amount of rhetoric or voluminous discussion can possibly diminish the overwhelming importance of the point.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by onthebottom View Post
    Yet another smoking gun?
    LOL. Yep. Just like the Steele Dosier/Comey/Stormy/Michael Aviannti/Colusion Delusion etc

    Give it up Dems...Focus ona viable candidate for 2024. Seriously thye have no chance on Nov 3

    Their own darn fault as well as they have been trying to have President Trump removed before he was even sworn in...DEspite being democratically elected

    NO proof of anything. Heck they cannot even speculate

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by americanson View Post
    LOL. Yep. Just like the Steele Dosier/Comey/Stormy/Michael Aviannti/Colusion Delusion etc

    Give it up Dems...Focus ona viable candidate for 2024. Seriously thye have no chance on Nov 3

    Their own darn fault as well as they have been trying to have President Trump removed before he was even sworn in...DEspite being democratically elected

    NO proof of anything. Heck they cannot even speculate
    Another sucker who actually thinks Trump is truthful.
    Donít be a tough guy. Donít be a fool! I will call you later

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Frankfooter View Post
    Another sucker who actually thinks Trump is truthful.
    It has nothing with him being truthful or not all the evidence points to impeachment but the Senate won't remove him. It's an exercise in futility.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Gooseifur View Post
    It has nothing with him being truthful or not all the evidence points to impeachment but the Senate won't remove him. It's an exercise in futility.
    Not at all.
    The dems can say they are the party that supports the rule of law.
    The GOP will be stuck saying they support bribery.
    Donít be a tough guy. Donít be a fool! I will call you later

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by americanson View Post
    LOL. Yep. Just like the Steele Dosier/Comey/Stormy/Michael Aviannti/Colusion Delusion etc

    Give it up Dems...Focus ona viable candidate for 2024. Seriously thye have no chance on Nov 3

    Their own darn fault as well as they have been trying to have President Trump removed before he was even sworn in...DEspite being democratically elected

    NO proof of anything. Heck they cannot even speculate
    How about the FBI Spying on Trump's campaign??


    On ignore: Disrespectful Individuals!!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gooseifur View Post
    It's an exercise in futility.
    Not really. It is an exercise in uncovering the truth so that even if the senate does nothing, the public will have seen what happened. They will know the facts when they go to vote.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by shack View Post
    Not really. It is an exercise in uncovering the truth so that even if the senate does nothing, the public will have seen what happened. They will know the facts when they go to vote.
    They already know the facts it's all over TV and social media. Half of them care what he did the other half don't. It's now for show. We know what he did. I think he should be impeached but what I think doesn't matter.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Frankfooter View Post
    Not at all.
    The dems can say they are the party that supports the rule of law.
    The GOP will be stuck saying they support bribery.
    The problem is half the country doesn't care what he did.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Gooseifur View Post
    The problem is half the country doesn't care what he did.
    43% of the country doesn't care.
    That's his base.
    Donít be a tough guy. Donít be a fool! I will call you later

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Frankfooter View Post
    43% of the country doesn't care.
    That's his base.
    No only 50% is for impeachment

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Gooseifur View Post
    No only 50% is for impeachment
    Double "no" as 50% is for impeachment and REMOVAL from his Golden Toilet Throne.
    I'm a bitter house**** baby....so why don't you **** me.

  16. #16
    The evidence for impeachment is overwhelming. Really makes no difference. The Chosen One will never permit his employees in the Senate to vote for conviction.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by toguy5252 View Post
    The evidence for impeachment is overwhelming. Really makes no difference. The Chosen One will never permit his employees in the Senate to vote for conviction.
    Clear and compelling, mountainous and unshakeable evidence.
    I'm a bitter house**** baby....so why don't you **** me.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Anbarandy View Post
    Double "no" as 50% is for impeachment and REMOVAL from his Golden Toilet Throne.
    You are correct.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by shack View Post
    Not really. It is an exercise in uncovering the truth so that even if the senate does nothing, the public will have seen what happened. They will know the facts when they go to vote.
    Just like what happened with Slick Willy? Impeached but not removed by the Dem senate. Everyone learned the truth about him but it didn't seem to affect him finishing his term. He was a scumbag but did a half decent job running the country. Similar to Trump, except Trump does better with the economy which resonates more with voters.
    swollen member

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Gooseifur View Post
    No only 50% is for impeachment
    And only 42% are his base.
    When the 50% who want Trump impeached and removed from office increases it will make Trump's reelection, should the GOP refuse to remove him, impossible.
    Donít be a tough guy. Donít be a fool! I will call you later

  21. #21
    https://youtu.be/Rf8nYm4eeYY
    Rudy daring his enemies to lock him up

  22. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Frankfooter View Post
    And only 42% are his base.
    When the 50% who want Trump impeached and removed from office increases it will make Trump's reelection, should the GOP refuse to remove him, impossible.
    Well it's at 50% now after all the testimony. Now all that's left is the dog and pony show that all the politicians will put on. I doubt it moves anymore

  23. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Gooseifur View Post
    Well it's at 50% now after all the testimony. Now all that's left is the dog and pony show that all the politicians will put on. I doubt it moves anymore
    Trump's only strategy now is to try to stall all requests for documents, testimony, taxes and evidence through court challenges.
    Given what we just found out about his tax fraud, its pretty clear why.

    Why do you support him even though he's obviously a BS artist guilty of fraud in every facet of his business?
    Donít be a tough guy. Donít be a fool! I will call you later

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Frankfooter View Post
    Trump's only strategy now is to try to stall all requests for documents, testimony, taxes and evidence through court challenges.
    Given what we just found out about his tax fraud, its pretty clear why.

    Why do you support him even though he's obviously a BS artist guilty of fraud in every facet of his business?
    Where did I say anything about supporting him? I think he should be impeached but it's not up to me.I'm just telling it like it is, They will be voting soon on impeachment soon. I don't think they are going to wait for all the court cases. They now see the longer they drag it out it will harm them. They see the 50% and just want to get it over with so they can concentrate on naming a nominee to run against him and focus on that. With the way the senate is, impeachment is a pipe dream.

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