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Toronto Sun - Two-thirds of Canadians say carbon tax will affect vote: Poll

Butler1000

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2011
28,815
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My issue with this is it will inevitably end up in the general coffers and used for other purposes, just like GST which was touted solely as a deficit and debt fighting tool. And never was.


Neither is this.
 

basketcase

Well-known member
Dec 29, 2005
59,843
6,341
113
My issue with this is it will inevitably end up in the general coffers and used for other purposes, just like GST which was touted solely as a deficit and debt fighting tool. And never was.


Neither is this.
If you have any interest in economic studies, the costs are supposed to serve as a disincentive to individuals and corporations. The additional funds the government can spend on green initiatives is just a bonus.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
80,679
17,854
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It still amazed me that there are people who are willing to buy the snake oil. Climate always changes, but were I you, I wouldn't be trading your bicycle for a kayak.
The snake oil in this case is that peddled by the Heartland Foundation, oil funded disinformation run by ex-tobacco lobbyists.

The climate always changes, but has never changed this rapidly or drastically except through giant asteroid collisions.
Drastic changes in the climate, like this, have also lead to mass extinctions.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
80,679
17,854
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As societies grow richer, the people start demanding cleaner and safer surrounding. And they're willing to pay for it. Within reason. Start using fascist methods and, even worse, threaten their economic stability and they will turn on you like a hooded snake- as the French(and others) are finding out. You can achieve almost any environmental goal if you do it gradually, keeping the economic and social costs at the forefront. Disregard them and you'll end up as the French President or Elizabeth May. I remember, as a kid, when the snow would turn black in the second day and you actually had to take a shower after walking in the rain. None of that, beside China, is happening, anymore.
Good argument for a slowly increasing carbon tax, like Trudeau's put in place.
So is pointing out that dirty rain and acid rain were environmental problems fixed through legislation and taxation.
 

jcpro

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2014
24,673
6,836
113
Good argument for a slowly increasing carbon tax, like Trudeau's put in place.
So is pointing out that dirty rain and acid rain were environmental problems fixed through legislation and taxation.
No. The industrial fallout was "fixed" by outsourcing heavy industrial activity to China and other places. The carbon taxation will follow the other "brilliant" ideas into the scrapyard because the voters can see the flawed premise behind it. It's easy to sell clean air and clean water, although even that the Canadian government cannot provide for the Natives, but selling a solution that does nothing, at the cost of standard of living, is a whole different matter.
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
80,679
17,854
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No. The industrial fallout was "fixed" by outsourcing heavy industrial activity to China and other places. The carbon taxation will follow the other "brilliant" ideas into the scrapyard because the voters can see the flawed premise behind it. It's easy to sell clean air and clean water, although even that the Canadian government cannot provide for the Natives, but selling a solution that does nothing, at the cost of standard of living, is a whole different matter.
More countries are moving to renewables to control their own energy costs just as much as to clean up environmental issues. Its now cheaper to go renewable and so much better for industrial activity and geopolitical reasons.
Clinging to fossil fuel is ridiculous now.
 

wigglee

Well-known member
Oct 13, 2010
9,833
1,612
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You do know the story about the boy who cried wolf, right? That's the climate warriors in a nutshell. They've been serving their catastrophic predictions for over a generation. When those failed to materialize, their target audience just decided to prioritize.
Your ignorance is almost genocidal
 

wigglee

Well-known member
Oct 13, 2010
9,833
1,612
113
You can achieve almost any environmental goal if you do it gradually, keeping the economic and social costs at the forefront. Disregard them and you'll end up as the French President or Elizabeth May.
If the free market price of oil went up by 50% you'd say " suck it up", but when the government puts a 5% carbon tax on it, that is suddenly intolerable for the economy. Does your illogic strike you yet?
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
10,489
170
63
Harper was the one that signed the Paris Accord, it was a conservative move that Trudeau is honouring.
In fact, Trudeau was the prime minister when the accord was signed in December 2015.

I think the point you were trying to make is that Trudeau's targets for reducing greenhouse gas emissions are the same targets that Harper set.
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
10,489
170
63
Things have certainly got interesting in the days after I started this thread.

As some of you may know, Environment Minister Catherine McKenna has now officially confirmed that carbon pricing won't be the centrepiece of Canada's efforts to reduce greenhouse gas emissions.

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/an...-away-from-the-carbon-tax?video_autoplay=true

https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/goldstein-mckennas-ludicrous-promise-on-carbon-pricing

Putting aside the government's virtue signalling and bullshit claims about being "on track" to meet its Paris commitments, it sure looks like the Trudeau government is abandoning its "action plan" on climate change.

It will be interesting to see the reaction from some of the doomsayers on TERB.

Since they insist they're all about the "science" and not just being partisans, one must assume they'll be denouncing the Liberals' decision in the strongest possible terms. :thumb:
 

Frankfooter

dangling member
Apr 10, 2015
80,679
17,854
113
Things have certainly got interesting in the days after I started this thread.

As some of you may know, Environment Minister Catherine McKenna has now officially confirmed that carbon pricing won't be the centrepiece of Canada's efforts to reduce greenhouse gas emissions.

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/an...-away-from-the-carbon-tax?video_autoplay=true

https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/goldstein-mckennas-ludicrous-promise-on-carbon-pricing

Putting aside the government's virtue signalling and bullshit claims about being "on track" to meet its Paris commitments, it sure looks like the Trudeau government is abandoning its "action plan" on climate change.

It will be interesting to see the reaction from some of the doomsayers on TERB.

Since they insist they're all about the "science" and not just being partisans, one must assume they'll be denouncing the Liberals' decision in the strongest possible terms. :thumb:
I see, so you think Trudeau should raise the carbon tax and that, despite what you have said earlier, a carbon tax is the best way to reduce CO2 output?
 

jcpro

Well-known member
Jan 31, 2014
24,673
6,836
113
Things have certainly got interesting in the days after I started this thread.

As some of you may know, Environment Minister Catherine McKenna has now officially confirmed that carbon pricing won't be the centrepiece of Canada's efforts to reduce greenhouse gas emissions.

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/an...-away-from-the-carbon-tax?video_autoplay=true

https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/goldstein-mckennas-ludicrous-promise-on-carbon-pricing

Putting aside the government's virtue signalling and bullshit claims about being "on track" to meet its Paris commitments, it sure looks like the Trudeau government is abandoning its "action plan" on climate change.

It will be interesting to see the reaction from some of the doomsayers on TERB.

Since they insist they're all about the "science" and not just being partisans, one must assume they'll be denouncing the Liberals' decision in the strongest possible terms. :thumb:
Because the real existential crisis is being voted out of office.
 

bver_hunter

Well-known member
Nov 5, 2005
27,462
5,654
113
I see, so you think Trudeau should raise the carbon tax and that, despite what you have said earlier, a carbon tax is the best way to reduce CO2 output?
The majority of Canadians believe that Canada has to do more for Climate Change. Only the Climate Change Deniers cannot accept this facts!!
 

Butler1000

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2011
28,815
3,470
113
Things have certainly got interesting in the days after I started this thread.

As some of you may know, Environment Minister Catherine McKenna has now officially confirmed that carbon pricing won't be the centrepiece of Canada's efforts to reduce greenhouse gas emissions.

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/an...-away-from-the-carbon-tax?video_autoplay=true

https://torontosun.com/opinion/columnists/goldstein-mckennas-ludicrous-promise-on-carbon-pricing

Putting aside the government's virtue signalling and bullshit claims about being "on track" to meet its Paris commitments, it sure looks like the Trudeau government is abandoning its "action plan" on climate change.

It will be interesting to see the reaction from some of the doomsayers on TERB.

Since they insist they're all about the "science" and not just being partisans, one must assume they'll be denouncing the Liberals' decision in the strongest possible terms. :thumb:
Wait until they approve the pipeline in a couple of days. .........
 

Butler1000

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2011
28,815
3,470
113
The majority of Canadians believe that Canada has to do more for Climate Change. Only the Climate Change Deniers cannot accept this facts!!
So if Trudeau abandons the tax and approved the pipeline you won't be voting for Trudeau?
 

Fathammer

Banned
Mar 9, 2018
961
0
0
The majority of Canadians believe that Canada has to do more for Climate Change. Only the Climate Change Deniers cannot accept this facts!!
Tell us how we can fight climate change. I will support a reasonable and scientific answer. Also, explain how your solution works. Maybe then people will believe in the Climate Hoax?

At this point, PAYING TO POLLUTE doesnt seem like a credible way to breathe fresh air or swim/drink clean water.....
 

Moviefan-2

Court Jester
Oct 17, 2011
10,489
170
63
Two more polls have confirmed that Canadians oppose carbon pricing.

CBC News -- Canadians are worried about climate change, but many don't want to pay taxes to fight it: Poll: https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/election-poll-climate-change-1.5178514

Toronto Sun -- Carbon taxes make businesses less competitive: Poll: https://torontosun.com/news/national/carbon-taxes-make-businesses-less-competitive-poll

No wonder the Liberals have abandoned the plan to make carbon pricing the centrepiece of their so-called "action plan" on climate change.
 
Ashley Madison
Toronto Escorts