Former Ambassador Says China’s President Wouldn’t Even Take Trudeau’s Phone Call

Conil · May 23, 2019

Canada'a back LOL

Absolutely pathetic.

As I’ve said before, the Trudeau government has put Canadians at risk by showing repeated weakness in response to China’s continuing escalations against our nation.

And now, it’s so pathetic that a former Canadian Ambassador to China Guy Saint-Jacques says China wouldn’t even pick up the phone if Justin Trudeau called:

“Nobody in the Chinese government wants to meet with a Canadian minister or special envoy — even if the prime minister were to phone [Chinese] President Xi Jinping, he would not take the call,” Saint-Jacques said.”

This is appalling.

Canada has been so severely weakened that it’s not even seen as necessary for our calls to be answered.
That’s not only bad news for Canada as a whole, but it’s terrible news for the two Canadians detained in China. Michael Spavor and Michael Kovrig face a very serious situation, and the prospect for their release appears even dimmer if China won’t even answer Trudeau’s calls.

Chrystia Freeland also recently pointed out that she’s asked for meetings with her counterparts in China, but that she isn’t getting any response.

If Trudeau and Freeland had an ounce of sense they would realize that their approach to China has been a total failure. By allowing China to escalate, while simultaneously ruling out any escalation, Freeland and Trudeau have sent the message that Canada can be bullied repeteadly and without any consequence. And it’s basic human nature that if bullying isn’t punished, then the bullying will continue and worsen.

So now, Canada is a laughingstock, our citizens are in danger, our interests are threatened, and the weakness of our leaders is inviting even more disaster.
Canada’s Back!

https://www.spencerfernando.com/201...sident-wouldnt-even-take-trudeaus-phone-call/

wilbur · May 24, 2019

So how is JT going to get Xi to pick up the phone.... buy being more aggressive?

Something Freeland and her puppy Trudeau don't seem to understand about China (and they fired an ambassador who did, married into the Chinese culture). They don't do business with those who disrespect them, especially if they don't need to. Arresting Meng was a slap in the face, and lined up Canada with US interests.

China's trade with Canada is only 1/50th of its world trade. China doesn't need Canada; that's why it doesn't need Canada's canola. Next will be the 230 tonnes of lobsters shipped weekly to China from Halifax and Moncton on 747 cargo planes.

It's probably going to be some sort of 'virus' they will discover in the lobster. Canada will complain to the WTO; Canada will win, but by the time it gets resolved, 5000 fishermen will have lost their boats. If Canada wants to raise the ante and retaliate, it will only hurt Canadian jobs and investments, BIG time; China is Canada's second largest trading partner. China can get all it wants elsewhere, especially Russia. China always assumed that it had a friendship with Canada, for historical reasons. Freeland has now lined up Canada with US geopolitics, but with no benefit to its national interests (jobs), as the US still treats Canada like a banana republic.

This is proof that Trudeau runs the most incompetent government in Canadian history; all virtue signaling, identity politics and no real substance. Even Harper would have sorted this out a long time ago. Despite Harper's conservatism, he wasn't a neocon; Freeland is.

Frankfooter · May 24, 2019

wilbur said:
So how is JT going to get Xi to pick up the phone.... buy being more aggressive?

Something Freeland and her puppy Trudeau don't seem to understand about China (and they fired an ambassador who did, married into the Chinese culture). They don't do business with those who disrespect them, especially if they don't need to. Arresting Meng was a slap in the face, and lined up Canada with US interests.

China's trade with Canada is only 1/50th of its world trade. China doesn't need Canada; that's why it doesn't need Canada's canola. Next will be the 230 tonnes of lobsters shipped weekly to China from Halifax and Moncton on 747 cargo planes.

It's probably going to be some sort of 'virus' they will discover in the lobster. Canada will complain to the WTO; Canada will win, but by the time it gets resolved, 5000 fishermen will have lost their boats. If Canada wants to raise the ante and retaliate, it will only hurt Canadian jobs and investments, BIG time; China is Canada's second largest trading partner. China can get all it wants elsewhere, especially Russia. China always assumed that it had a friendship with Canada, for historical reasons. Freeland has now lined up Canada with US geopolitics, but with no benefit to its national interests (jobs), as the US still treats Canada like a banana republic.

This is proof that Trudeau runs the most incompetent government in Canadian history; all virtue signaling, identity politics and no real substance. Even Harper would have sorted this out a long time ago. Despite Harper's conservatism, he wasn't a neocon; Freeland is.

That's your 'proof' its the 'most incompetent' gov't in history?

Give me a break. Just take a look at Doug Ford and how much he's fucked up and pissed off of Ontario in one year, that's incompetence.
Trudeau? A rumour about a phone call?

Arresting Meng wasn't smart, it played to US interests but there is no point trying to do that with Trump in power, he's such a fuck up that its not worth trying to please him, he's so senile he'll just forget and the next time Fox says something about Canada he'll be off trying to put more tariffs in place. But that was not 'the most incompetent' move ever, not by a long shot.

Mr Deeds · May 24, 2019

I wouldn't take his call either :hand:

danmand · May 24, 2019

Conil said:
Canada'a back LOL

Absolutely pathetic.

As I’ve said before, the Trudeau government has put Canadians at risk by showing repeated weakness in response to China’s continuing escalations against our nation.

And now, it’s so pathetic that a former Canadian Ambassador to China Guy Saint-Jacques says China wouldn’t even pick up the phone if Justin Trudeau called:

“Nobody in the Chinese government wants to meet with a Canadian minister or special envoy — even if the prime minister were to phone [Chinese] President Xi Jinping, he would not take the call,” Saint-Jacques said.”

This is appalling.

Canada has been so severely weakened that it’s not even seen as necessary for our calls to be answered.
That’s not only bad news for Canada as a whole, but it’s terrible news for the two Canadians detained in China. Michael Spavor and Michael Kovrig face a very serious situation, and the prospect for their release appears even dimmer if China won’t even answer Trudeau’s calls.

Chrystia Freeland also recently pointed out that she’s asked for meetings with her counterparts in China, but that she isn’t getting any response.

If Trudeau and Freeland had an ounce of sense they would realize that their approach to China has been a total failure. By allowing China to escalate, while simultaneously ruling out any escalation, Freeland and Trudeau have sent the message that Canada can be bullied repeteadly and without any consequence. And it’s basic human nature that if bullying isn’t punished, then the bullying will continue and worsen.

So now, Canada is a laughingstock, our citizens are in danger, our interests are threatened, and the weakness of our leaders is inviting even more disaster.
Canada’s Back!

It is pathetic, that Canada is doing the dirty work for USA. But PLEEEEEAAAASE stop insinuating that a conservative goivernment would have done better. The conservatives would have bent over much harder.

wilbur · May 24, 2019

Frankfooter said:
That's your 'proof' its the 'most incompetent' gov't in history?

Give me a break. Just take a look at Doug Ford and how much he's fucked up and pissed off of Ontario in one year, that's incompetence.
Trudeau? A rumour about a phone call?

Arresting Meng wasn't smart, it played to US interests but there is no point trying to do that with Trump in power, he's such a fuck up that its not worth trying to please him, he's so senile he'll just forget and the next time Fox says something about Canada he'll be off trying to put more tariffs in place. But that was not 'the most incompetent' move ever, not by a long shot.

I was referring to Federal Governments.

But while we're at it, there is no 'proof' that Ford's government is any more incompetent than McGuinty's or Wynne's. Ford's only been in power for less than a year. You can't make an assessment of a government's performance on what you assume the outcome is going to be. This is a totally biased and partisan position. You betray your lack of objectivity.

wilbur · May 24, 2019

danmand said:
It is pathetic, that Canada is doing the dirty work for USA. But PLEEEEEAAAASE stop insinuating that a conservative goivernment would have done better. The conservatives would have bent over much harder.

If you care to drop the polarized partisanship for a moment, I make the point that Harper came into power with an anti-China Commie agenda. That didn't prevent him from going to China, mellowing a bit, maintain Canada's traditional policy towards China, and expand Canadian trade with them. An anti-commie demagogue would have stirred up a lot of shit and placed ideology before the national interest, which he did not. Fast forward to a few months ago, Freeland the neocon, subverted traditional Canadian foreign policy for her own pro-US neoconservative geopolitical stance, and harming the Canadian national interest by putting tens of thousands of jobs in jeopardy as a result. Harper would never have done that, despite his right-wing domestic political stance.

And this is not a Liberal/Conservative debate. I am convinced that ex- Foreign Minister Dion, who Trudeau fired at the behest of Freeland, would never have gone the way of antagonizing China, and neither would Manley and Dosanj, to name a few examples. This is not about Liberal-Conservative politics. It is about ideologues who have subverted Canada's traditional foreign policy for their own personal agendas.

If Sheer wants to out-do Trudeau about being tough on China, then he's a bigger idiot and God help us all, and I fear that that may be the case. Buy I want to make it perfectly clear that, so far, Trudeau is one of the biggest idiots that has ever purported to run
Canada. He is the front-man for the real backroom power boys and girls, who's only interest is to further their own agendas and have no qualms in ruining the Liberal Party itself.

nottyboi · May 24, 2019

You really think they would speak to Scheer? Harper has throughly solidified the image of Canada as a US proxy and lapdog. We are not an independant country. What can we do for Xi? NADA. So if we cannot do anything for Xi, why would he waste his time talking to us? BTW Freeland has done NOTHING to chart a seperate course in our foreign policy. We are still US lapdogs. Scheer has made it clear he would be an even more docile lapdog, joining US missile defence etc etc. woof woof!!!

wilbur · May 24, 2019

nottyboi said:
You really think they would speak to Scheer? Harper has throughly solidified the image of Canada as a US proxy and lapdog. We are not an independant country. What can we do for Xi? NADA. So if we cannot do anything for Xi, why would he waste his time talking to us? BTW Freeland has done NOTHING to chart a seperate course in our foreign policy. We are still US lapdogs. Scheer has made it clear he would be an even more docile lapdog, joining US missile defence etc etc. woof woof!!!

Why would they not talk to Sheer, if he somehow changed Canada's policy towards China and resolved the Meng issue. China does not care who runs Canada, only if they will deal pragmatically. China doesn't have to trade with Canada. It's in Canada's interests to mend relations, and if they did, China would respond positively. Canada will not get any benefit with its realignment with US geopolitics, execpt perhaps Chystia will get more photo ops with head neocon Pompeo and Bolton.

While Harper was originally anti commie whatever, including anti China and Russia (not commie anymore), he did still go to China and expanded trade relations. He didn't slap China in the face, like Trudeau/Freeland did. Whatever you think of Harper, he maintained Canada's traditional foreign policy towards China.

Few people seem to understand that relations with China are based on respect and face. Arresting Meng in Vancouver was a slap in the face to China, and the loss of relationship (GuanXi) means all bets are off. That was Freeland's work, as she continuously bends to the Americans. She sold Canada's sovereignty by agreeing in the USMCA to clear with the Americans any free trade relationship with China. Canada's diplomats have meddled in Venezuelan politics, contrary to their diplomatic status, and the only beneficiary if Maduro is ousted, is the US oil companies. She has an ulterior agenda than Canada's national interest.

No wonder Canada can't get a seat on the UN Security Council; Canada used to be the honest broker, the creator of Peace Keeping, the middle power most countries would listen to. Now, Canada will not get voted in because we have aligned ourselves with the US, so what's the point to most non-aligned countries. That was started by Harper, but re-enforced by Freeland.

If Sheer decides to out-do Trudeau and Freeland on taking a harder line against China, he's a bigger idiot than Trudeau because he has no idea of the scale of Canada's potential losses; Trudeau/Freeland are so inept that they kept on saying at the outset that, as concerns China, politics and trade were unrelated; now we're faced with the potential loss of market/income to over 100,000 Canadians, as the stakes are raised at every stage of this fiasco.

Darts · May 24, 2019

"Chrystia Freeland also recently pointed out that she’s asked for meetings with her counterparts in China, but that she isn’t getting any response."

She spoke at Nathan Phillips Square to-night. It was so embarrassing but that is another subject.

nottyboi · May 24, 2019

The US still vastly outstrips China in economic importance. Since there is a trade war between the two we have to pick a side. But yes some announcements from Scheer including Missile defence and the embassy in Jerusalem make it pretty obvious that Canadas foreign policy will be even more closely aligned with the US under him.

wilbur said:
Why would they not talk to Sheer, if he somehow changed Canada's policy towards China and resolved the Meng issue. China does not care who runs Canada, only if they will deal pragmatically. China doesn't have to trade with Canada. It's in Canada's interests to mend relations, and if they did, China would respond positively. Canada will not get any benefit with its realignment with US geopolitics, execpt perhaps Chystia will get more photo ops with head neocon Pompeo and Bolton.

While Harper was originally anti commie whatever, including anti China and Russia (not commie anymore), he did still go to China and expanded trade relations. He didn't slap China in the face, like Trudeau/Freeland did. Whatever you think of Harper, he maintained Canada's traditional foreign policy towards China.

Few people seem to understand that relations with China are based on respect and face. Arresting Meng in Vancouver was a slap in the face to China, and the loss of relationship (GuanXi) means all bets are off. That was Freeland's work, as she continuously bends to the Americans. She sold Canada's sovereignty by agreeing in the USMCA to clear with the Americans any free trade relationship with China. Canada's diplomats have meddled in Venezuelan politics, contrary to their diplomatic status, and the only beneficiary if Maduro is ousted, is the US oil companies. She has an ulterior agenda than Canada's national interest.

No wonder Canada can't get a seat on the UN Security Council; Canada used to be the honest broker, the creator of Peace Keeping, the middle power most countries would listen to. Now, Canada will not get voted in because we have aligned ourselves with the US, so what's the point to most non-aligned countries. That was started by Harper, but re-enforced by Freeland.

If Sheer decides to out-do Trudeau and Freeland on taking a harder line against China, he's a bigger idiot than Trudeau because he has no idea of the scale of Canada's potential losses; Trudeau/Freeland are so inept that they kept on saying at the outset that, as concerns China, politics and trade were unrelated; now we're faced with the potential loss of market/income to over 100,000 Canadians, as the stakes are raised at every stage of this fiasco.

wilbur · May 25, 2019

nottyboi said:
The US still vastly outstrips China in economic importance. Since there is a trade war between the two we have to pick a side. But yes some announcements from Scheer including Missile defence and the embassy in Jerusalem make it pretty obvious that Canadas foreign policy will be even more closely aligned with the US under him.

We don't have to choose sides, and we never did before Freeland showed up. Now we did indeed pick sides (at least Freeland did it for us), but the US does not have the market to absorb the enormous amount of trade that we could lose with China. And even if they did, the US is not Canada's friend, in a practical sense; yes, they say nice things to us and pat us on the head, but when it comes to trade, they don't hesitate to break agreements they sign with us, like NAFTA and the softwood lumber penalties they keep on reimposing, time after time the trade tribunal rules in our favour. To show their good will towards Canada, the US slapped tariffs on our steel and aluminium under the pretext that we were a security risk; how insulting. So don't count of the US to pick up the slack when China cuts off 3 billion dollars worth of canola.... at least not at the same prices.

Countries don't have friends; they have interests. This is the basis of international relations, and Freeland doesn't understand this. The countries that she is courting, so that they can gang up on China, may be saying nicey pro-Canada things, but they will never sacrifice their national interests. France just sold China 30 billion dollars worth of Airbus airplanes; they will never piss off the Chinese and risk losing those orders; conversely, this is exactly what Canada has done.

Global Affairs under Chrystia Freeland has been a circus. Dion might not have an ebullient personality, but at least he knew what he was doing and didn't push a personal agenda.

wigglee · May 25, 2019

It is clearly the asshole americans who threw us under the bus. We had a choice : either not arrest her and have the US declare economic war on us, or arrest her and have China declare economic war on us. Trudeau has nothing to do with it and Scheer would not have handled it any better. Unfortunately our traditional ally is now mismanaged by backstabbing lunatic. This is just another hollow attack by the Trudeau haters.

wilbur · May 25, 2019

wigglee said:
It is clearly the asshole americans who threw us under the bus. We had a choice : either not arrest her and have the US declare economic war on us, or arrest her and have China declare economic war on us. Trudeau has nothing to do with it and Scheer would not have handled it any better. Unfortunately our traditional ally is now mismanaged by backstabbing lunatic. This is just another hollow attack by the Trudeau haters.

The US could not declare economic war on us because it would negatively affect their own economy, as both are too closely tied. But they do regularly screw us when they can. Did you know that the US does not recognize the North West passage as being Canadian territorial waters... meaning they can sail their oil polluting ships withouit telling us about it first? Some friend!

As John Manley said, since Trudeau knew about the plan 4 days before they arrested her, have a minor functionary call her up and tell her to stay away. Chrystia Freeland was hell bent on pleasing the Americans because she needs them to support her stance on Ukraine, and be on the same page for her hate of Russia. She had to line up Canada with US geopolitical policy, and that includes the hostility towards China. Nobody considered that good relations with China is essential for trade, especially as it concerns a country (Canada) that China can easily dispense with. She still doesn't understand why she can't get a meeting with her Chinese counterpart: China has turned its back on Canada and they don't care. Sheer may have a chance if he doesn't turn out the be as dumb as the Trudeau/Freeland duet.... but I'm not holding my breath. Mr. Dimples seems very shallow.

jcpro · May 25, 2019

I would hate to be Freeland. For the sake of her lefty sensibilities she must root for Trump to fail. But, to salvage her government's China policy she must hope for his success in the China negotiations.

nottyboi · May 25, 2019

wilbur said:
We don't have to choose sides, and we never did before Freeland showed up. Now we did indeed pick sides (at least Freeland did it for us), but the US does not have the market to absorb the enormous amount of trade that we could lose with China. And even if they did, the US is not Canada's friend, in a practical sense; yes, they say nice things to us and pat us on the head, but when it comes to trade, they don't hesitate to break agreements they sign with us, like NAFTA and the softwood lumber penalties they keep on reimposing, time after time the trade tribunal rules in our favour. To show their good will towards Canada, the US slapped tariffs on our steel and aluminium under the pretext that we were a security risk; how insulting. So don't count of the US to pick up the slack when China cuts off 3 billion dollars worth of canola.... at least not at the same prices.

Countries don't have friends; they have interests. This is the basis of international relations, and Freeland doesn't understand this. The countries that she is courting, so that they can gang up on China, may be saying nicey pro-Canada things, but they will never sacrifice their national interests. France just sold China 30 billion dollars worth of Airbus airplanes; they will never piss off the Chinese and risk losing those orders; conversely, this is exactly what Canada has done.

Global Affairs under Chrystia Freeland has been a circus. Dion might not have an ebullient personality, but at least he knew what he was doing and didn't push a personal agenda.

If you think the situation is the same as it was before with our without Freeland you are whacked. Canada chose a side under Harper, it was 100% pro American. It was under Harper that for the first time in history Canada lost a vote for a seat on the UN security council. The world at that point declared we were Americas lap dog, and they were right. It has not changed much under Trudeau that is for sure. Now Scheer intends to align us with the USA even more. Yes I preferred Dion to Freeland. Yes the US is 100% open to exploiting Canada. They want our oil cheap, they want our Canola cheap etc etc.

mandrill · May 25, 2019

wilbur said:
If you care to drop the polarized partisanship for a moment, I make the point that Harper came into power with an anti-China Commie agenda. That didn't prevent him from going to China, mellowing a bit, maintain Canada's traditional policy towards China, and expand Canadian trade with them. An anti-commie demagogue would have stirred up a lot of shit and placed ideology before the national interest, which he did not. Fast forward to a few months ago, Freeland the neocon, subverted traditional Canadian foreign policy for her own pro-US neoconservative geopolitical stance, and harming the Canadian national interest by putting tens of thousands of jobs in jeopardy as a result. Harper would never have done that, despite his right-wing domestic political stance.

And this is not a Liberal/Conservative debate. I am convinced that ex- Foreign Minister Dion, who Trudeau fired at the behest of Freeland, would never have gone the way of antagonizing China, and neither would Manley and Dosanj, to name a few examples. This is not about Liberal-Conservative politics. It is about ideologues who have subverted Canada's traditional foreign policy for their own personal agendas.

If Sheer wants to out-do Trudeau about being tough on China, then he's a bigger idiot and God help us all, and I fear that that may be the case. Buy I want to make it perfectly clear that, so far, Trudeau is one of the biggest idiots that has ever purported to run
Canada. He is the front-man for the real backroom power boys and girls, who's only interest is to further their own agendas and have no qualms in ruining the Liberal Party itself.

Interesting posts.

Curious about who you think the "real backroom power boys and girls" are?

nottyboi · May 25, 2019

Has Scheer said ANYTHING about the Meng issue? If anyone thinks Harper would break a US treaty to placate the Chinese I dunno what you are smoking. He wanted to send Canadians to die in Iraq with the American cannon fodder.

Frankfooter · May 25, 2019

Garrett said:
Nice deflection (with a crystal ball no less). Trudeau has attempted to manage international affairs via twitter, and social justice virtue signalling.

No, you're confusing Trump with Trudeau.
Trudeau still does pressers and lets his team speak without contradicting them.

Darts · May 25, 2019

wilbur said:
the US is not Canada's friend, in a practical sense; yes, they say nice things to us and pat us on the head,

Agree with most of your post. However, I will give the devil (the U.S.) his dues. It was the U.S that warned us about 3 Islamic bombing plots.

Former Ambassador Says China’s President Wouldn’t Even Take Trudeau’s Phone Call

Well-known member

Active member

dangling member

Muff Diver Extraordinaire

Well-known member

Active member

Active member

Well-known member

Active member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Active member

Well-known member

Active member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

dangling member

Well-known member