Teachers

basketcase said:

But data and talk of sampling; that's just facts and the teachers want to to understand facts. Don't give in. Rely on the the memory that you met a teacher once.

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Sorry, I am a little confused about this.

I agree that there are cuts to be made. Almost all bureaucracies need cuts and streamlining.

This is likely not the method to do it. Online courses, bigger class sizes and job losses will hurt our system, the future, and the economy. Everybody needs to see this.

K Douglas said:

Cops are under significant more scrutiny on a day to day basis than are teachers. You can't deny that. Which makes it more difficult for truly bad cops to slip through the cracks so to speak.

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I won't deny that if they make a mistake, it is way more critical. My uncle is a cop. A large portion of his day is menial. You pay for the training and the experience and skill of a police officer.

Because everybody has been in school, they think they know the teacher's job. Very few people have even interacted with a cop.

A teacher's scrutiny is consistent and constant. Say or do one mistake, and you never know where and how you can get in trouble.

I work with teachers and students and learn and hear many stories.

bazokajoe said:

Throwing money at public sector workers doesn't make them better teachers,cops or nurses. Just makes them more greedy like everyone else.

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I agree completely.

You can't throw more money (which was a problem and still is) to improve bad situations. Logically, removing money can make things worse as it very likely by having an UNEDUCATED prime minister and minister of Education. Can you believe that? Two people in critical positions talking about education and making decisions about education WITHOUT post-secondary education.

Would you want an uneducated doctor? Mechanic? Police officer? Prime minister or education minister? Or teacher?

Exactly.

Darts said:

There are successful people who do not have a college/university degree but possess skills that have a practical value (e.g. trades people and entrepreneurs). Then there are some people with college/university degrees who live in mom's basement and play video games 24/7.


"Top 10 College Dropouts

TIME looks at some of the most successful people to never receive their sheepskins."

http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1988080_1988093_1988082,00.html

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Correct ,but although trades and entrepreneurs are people likely without post-secondary, they may actually received training in their field.

The two above I listed do not have training regarding the education system and pedagogy theory.

And listing the top 10 College dropouts is a sampling and response bias. There are millions more unsuccessful. This topic isn't about needing a degree to be successful, as Rob Ford and Lisa Thompson are successful in their careers, but my argument is that they do not have enough knowledge to be dictating the direction of this province in that area.

The problem with our system is that whole "it has to increase by inflation". But the law of compounding for jobs where people never leave actually makes their salaries and costs go up at much higher parabolic rate than in the private sector, as people 'jump' to a higher paid role, but their replacement often starts at the original lower rate, vs 1.02^10 compounding for that beginning salary.

I for one think it's unsustainable in the long-run with these public sectors.

K Douglas said:

... Which makes it more difficult for truly bad cops to slip through the cracks so to speak.

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Yet it's quite clear that many do.

And likely the scrutiny is that bad cops kill people.

basketcase said:

Yet it's quite clear that many do.

And likely the scrutiny is that bad cops kill people.

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For the record the vast majority of bad cops don't kill anyone.

We can tell how well or bad cops are doing their jobs. They
are there to bring criminals to justice. And even in peaceful
times we need them to prevent crimes. We hold them
responsible if we don't feel safe and crimes are rampant.

Teachers are required to impart knowledge and skills
on kids. But if they only barely do their jobs students
can always turn to private tutors. Just look around
and see how ubiquitous those private schools are.
And if students inadequately schooled are accepted
into universities with inflated grades they will
be taken care of after they failed 1st year chemistry
and calculus.

A teacher unable to teach a class of more than 30
undisciplined kids some respect is still doing his job
so long as he survived the kids.

The role of teachers is an essential one for our
society. I am all for smaller classes and hiring the
best teachers which means offering a generous
salary. But if resources are tight it will be the cops
and those in public health I would rather not to
downsize first. With teachers I am sure there is
no lack of qualified people who would die to get
their job even for bigger classes and longer working
hours.

Teaching doesn't stop when the class day is over. It's also on the parents to make sure they do their homework,behave in class and are taught respect for others. Kids behavior starts at home. Parents seem to forget that and like to blame teachers for their short comings.
Yes teachers are over paid by alot and should take pay cuts/freeze like the private sector has. They shouldn't be put on a pedestal.

Darts said:

............
4) The racial/gender/ethnic make-up of the force must be exactly the same as that of the general population............

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There is an over-representation of the white
among teachers in public schools. It is a good idea
to bring more minorities into the teacher's profession.
However I am sure the teachers' union will vehemently
oppose such affirmative action (notwithstanding
their liberal leaning) when their jobs are at stake.

There’s those that teach and those that do.

t.o.leafs.fan said:

The average worker is only productive (read: does work) for maybe 3 hours per day.

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LOL. I am self employed, 23 years now....if I was productive 3 hours a day I would be unemployed. Your 3-hours a day productivity rule is obviously for union government employees.

blueray said:

LOL. I am self employed, 23 years now....if I was productive 3 hours a day I would be unemployed. Your 3-hours a day productivity rule is obviously for union government employees.

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Lol. It's not my rule. It's the conclusion drawn from studying workers.

thailover said:

Overpaid,entitled,indoctrinate future generations with your champagne socialist bullshit

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+1 +2 +3 etc very well stated !

I wish Doug Ford would make school all year round like this they learn to keep quite. Some of us blue collar works have to work 2-3 jobs in order to make what they make and have no holidays and time to spears with family.

K Douglas said:

For the record the vast majority of bad cops don't kill anyone.

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Explain/Illustrate how you know this.

Unless you mean a lot of them commit rape, like that one in America who was convicted of raping about 20 women while in uniform.

....or even beat women senseless, like...well...it may be hard to keep score with that one.

Darts said:

Cops are under much more social pressure and scrutiny than teachers.

1) They are not allowed to interact with too many blacks.
2) They are not allowed to say a suspect is black.

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Just going to

1) They only seek to interact with blacks. (Kind of reminds me of that NY police captain allegedly telling one of his charges to fill the arrest quota of blacks. If he sees a White breaking the law, leave that be and make sure he finds someone black blinking too many times to find something to charge him with. Well, not in so many words.)
2) They are reluctant to say the suspect is white. Unless CP24 and the like choose not say so when relaying the news.
3) Like other members of society (let's include hookers) they generally give less Fs.
4) Why shouldn't it? When they say judged by a jury of your peers, you don't find it odd when the . But when (esp in the USA) it's cops they stack it with sympathizers of the cops, who could never relate to the victim.
5) And this is a problem why?? Oh, you're upset that decades of abuse and murder and coverups are caught on camera? You don't say.


Under pressure. lol