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Marrying someone for purposes of immigration (U.S.)?

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kkelso

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Apr 27, 2003
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Last week I was approached by a friend of mine with a proposition of marriage. She has lived in the US for 25+ years but is not a citizen, she's an F-2 (mom was an F-1). Her lack of citizenship is becoming problematic, and of course under the Trump administration that outlook is not getting any better.

I've known her five years, we are ex-lovers and good friends. I'll admit, I've never considered this direction.

Assuming that I could insulate myself from the financial consequences in the case of divorce, and that we could *prove* to the US government that our marriage was legit, what other risks would I face?

I would, of course, engage legal counsel before seriously considering any of this, but I know that many of my TERB brothers and sisters are learned in such things, and I wanted to get your take.

KK
 
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Butler1000

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Oct 31, 2011
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If it is a fake marriage that is fraud.

Remember these days they can dig through social media for years to establish whether a relationship existed and will. They can demand access to your social media accounts.

You do not want to commit fraud. Nor does your friend. It's not worth it.
 
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einar

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May 4, 2002
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I thought an F-2 visa was reserved for an under-21yo child of someone in the US on an study via (F-1). But whatever, Butler is of course right. But if you truly want to live together with this woman, under one roof, and as married, in sickness and in health and all that, no one is stopping you. It's not illegal to marry someone on a whim, as long as you are currently not married to someone else. What it *does* do is raise plenty of red flags, particularly when one party in the couple is in an uncertain immigration situation.

You'll need some evidence that this is a genuine marriage. Maybe start living together right now and see how it goes.
 
mandrill

mandrill

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Aug 23, 2001
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kkelso said:
Last week I was approached by a friend of mine with a proposition of marriage. She has lived in the US for 25+ years but is not a citizen, she's an F-2 (mom was an F-1). Her lack of citizenship is becoming problematic, and of course under the Trump administration that outlook is not getting any better.

I've known her five years, we are ex-lovers and good friends. I'll admit, I've never considered this direction.

Assuming that I could insulate myself from the financial consequences in the case of divorce, and that we could *prove* to the US government that our marriage was legit, what other risks would I face?

I would, of course, engage legal counsel before seriously considering any of this, but I know that many of my TERB brothers and sisters are learned in such things, and I wanted to get your take.

KK
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If the US is like Canada, be prepared for a rough ride with immigration prying into your lives and attempting to catch you out.

Do an ironclad pre nup.
 
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autumn96

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Jun 13, 2017
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If you guys have proof that you have known each other for five years (photos, emails, etc) that would go a long way towards helping you out.

What I would be REALLY concerned about though is the ramifications of marrying this woman. If it's not your intention to stay with her and start a life together, make sure that pre-nup is watertight...
 
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rhuarc29

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Apr 15, 2009
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Butler1000 said:
If it is a fake marriage that is fraud.

Remember these days they can dig through social media for years to establish whether a relationship existed and will. They can demand access to your social media accounts.

You do not want to commit fraud. Nor does your friend. It's not worth it.
Click to expand...
They're ex-lovers and still good friends. I don't think proving a relationship will be a problem.
The main problem will be insulating his finances, which is virtually impossible to make ironclad.
 
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kkelso

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Apr 27, 2003
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rhuarc29 said:
They're ex-lovers and still good friends. I don't think proving a relationship will be a problem.
The main problem will be insulating his finances, which is virtually impossible to make ironclad.
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Yes, this is definitely a worry. I might easily have married her 5 years ago and we've kept in touch, so the "relationship" part is not too much of a stretch.

However, she is a woman, and no matter how happy she is with the arrangement she is still a woman. Nothing spins a woman 180 like divorce, even in this circumstance.

To answer Elf, the benefits to me are significant and several, enough that I am considering it. A big chunk of it though is just doing the right thing. She's a law-abiding, productive, tax-paying member of society, and a good person to boot.

KK
 
F

fall

Well-known member
Dec 9, 2010
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kkelso said:
Yes, this is definitely a worry. I might easily have married her 5 years ago and we've kept in touch, so the "relationship" part is not too much of a stretch.

However, she is a woman, and no matter how happy she is with the arrangement she is still a woman. Nothing spins a woman 180 like divorce, even in this circumstance.

To answer Elf, the benefits to me are significant and several, enough that I am considering it. A big chunk of it though is just doing the right thing. She's a law-abiding, productive, tax-paying member of society, and a good person to boot.

KK
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She is not a stranger, you know her for a long time, and you think she is a good person. What here is to think about - go ahead and help her. I am not sure if she is paying you $$$ for that or you are getting a friend with benefits, or both, but just write down a good prenup, make sure your primary residence is well protected (which may be a problem if you own it and live there) and do it. It is, indeed, a good deed.
 
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superstar_88

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Jan 4, 2008
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Sounds to me like what is in it for you is also fraudulent which is why it is not divulged for the sake of getting valued advice from the group.

He already made clear it is a fake marriage. Ex lover and good friend has no relevance. Still fake and looking to pull one over the government for each of their personal gains

Wasn't the title clear enough?
 
malata

malata

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Jan 16, 2004
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i believe the other requirement is you need to prove you are financially stable to support her. If you are doing the whole nine yards with this marriage deal, i see no reason for this being not legit. Me thinks

 
K

kkelso

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2003
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malata said:
i believe the other requirement is you need to prove you are financially stable to support her. If you are doing the whole nine yards with this marriage deal, i see no reason for this being not legit. Me thinks
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Yup, that's not going to be an issue.

The more counsel I hear on this, the more it becomes a vanilla "protecting assets before a marriage" conundrum.

KK
 
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Rod Johnson

Member
Mar 13, 2017
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You also need to ask yourself why didn't you marry her long before all this came up.

Without knowing any more than what's already in this thread, I think you'd only be setting yourself up for a whole lot of drama.
 
SchlongConery

SchlongConery

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Jan 28, 2013
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kkelso said:
Yup, that's not going to be an issue.

The more counsel I hear on this, the more it becomes a vanilla "protecting assets before a marriage" conundrum.

KK
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Since when is conspiring to commit immigration fraud a "vanilla conundrum"?

I think you are trying to be seen by her as a "nice guy".

But have you really considered the potential consequences?

You clearly stated you are considering conspiring to enter into a sham marriage to circumvent US Immigration law. You can go to jail for it.

"A sham marriage or civil partnership is one where the relationship is not genuine but one party hopes to gain an immigration advantage from it. There is no subsisting relationship, dependency, or intent to live as husband and wife or civil partners."

 Your "pre-nup" is worthless, except to her or a Federal Prosecutor. It is evidence of, and based upon an underlying fraud. You would have to admit to Immigration fraud to if she ever tried to get at your money and you tried to enforce the pre-nup. To enforce it, you would have to admit it was a sham marriage. You won't have "clean hands" so all your money wasted on a pre-nup would be worthless too.

You seem to be talking yourself into minimizing the risks and consequences, but the fact is that it is a "sham marriage". Do you really think you are smart enough to outsmart ICE. Do you think she can hold up under questioning? l Do you really think you and the woman are really that sharp on Immigration law and everything?

Are you willing to pay the price to defend yourself?

Are you willing to pay the price in terms of a fine and jail?

She must have one golden pussy for even considering taking the risk.


Besides... and here is the rub.... she doesn't become a citizen just by marrying you. You would both have to go through the whole Fiancee Visa process. Which would raise red flags if she has been here for 25 years.

It is a really, really, bad idea my friend.
 
Scarey

Scarey

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Mar 22, 2002
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Edmonton.I wear a cowboy hat sometimes...
Not knowing the full story, this seems like a hell of a lot of downside, with not a lot of upside. I've known 3 women in my life so intimately that I thought they would die for me...…...2 tore me to shreds over nothing more than anger and opportunity.Tread lightly here.
 
mandrill

mandrill

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Aug 23, 2001
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SchlongConery said:
Since when is conspiring to commit immigration fraud a "vanilla conundrum"?

I think you are trying to be seen by her as a "nice guy".

But have you really considered the potential consequences?

You clearly stated you are considering conspiring to enter into a sham marriage to circumvent US Immigration law. You can go to jail for it.

"A sham marriage or civil partnership is one where the relationship is not genuine but one party hopes to gain an immigration advantage from it. There is no subsisting relationship, dependency, or intent to live as husband and wife or civil partners."

 Your "pre-nup" is worthless, except to her or a Federal Prosecutor. It is evidence of, and based upon an underlying fraud. You would have to admit to Immigration fraud to if she ever tried to get at your money and you tried to enforce the pre-nup. To enforce it, you would have to admit it was a sham marriage. You won't have "clean hands" so all your money wasted on a pre-nup would be worthless too.

You seem to be talking yourself into minimizing the risks and consequences, but the fact is that it is a "sham marriage". Do you really think you are smart enough to outsmart ICE. Do you think she can hold up under questioning? l Do you really think you and the woman are really that sharp on Immigration law and everything?

Are you willing to pay the price to defend yourself?

Are you willing to pay the price in terms of a fine and jail?

She must have one golden pussy for even considering taking the risk.


Besides... and here is the rub.... she doesn't become a citizen just by marrying you. You would both have to go through the whole Fiancee Visa process. Which would raise red flags if she has been here for 25 years.

It is a really, really, bad idea my friend.
Click to expand...

Shlong, buddy, simmer down.

I've been a helpless bystander in some awful immigration train wrecks, but no one (at least in Beaver Land) has ever gotten charged with immigration fraud. Maybe the Americans do it differently.

And you can't void a pre nup, by claiming the marriage was a fraud. Indeed, the fact that the marriage is a sham means that the pre nup isn't even necessary BECAUSE THERE IS NO VALID MARRIAGE.
 
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