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Amazon pulls the plug on second HQ location in New York

NiceToMeetYou

Active member
Oct 24, 2010
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I think the main reason is that Amazon is anticipating a very slow down or even a recession in the USA in the near future. So that why Amazon is putting off the expansion and building the second corporate HQ in the Long Island City where it's in the rundown part of Queen. I've been to the Long Island City before and lived in various places in New York for over 8 years.

Opposition from the local residents is everywhere no matter you go and want to build new and large buildings for the HQ or anything. So it's normal. Amazon just uses this opposition from the local as an EXCUSE to scrap their future plan. The real reason is that Amazon is expecting a recession in the USA where over 7 million Americans right now cannot make their payments of the automobiles' loans for three or more months.
 

Smallcock

Active member
Jun 5, 2009
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^^^
I think you're absolutely right.
 

kkelso

Well-known member
Apr 27, 2003
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LOL, "fulfilment centres"

Most people call them warehouses, but hey, whatever floats your boat.
Fulfillment Centers and Warehouses serve very different functions, and require very different skill sets. Think phone girl vs. SP.

KK
 

Darts

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2017
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Opposition from the local residents is everywhere no matter you go and want to build new and large buildings for the HQ or anything.
Even more so in hardcore lefty areas like NYC. Do they actually think they "saved" $3 billion because Amazon is not locating there?

I think Citigroup/Citibank is still expanding in Long Island City. Their building(s) can be easily reached by subway from Manhattan.
 

Keebler Elf

The Original Elf
Aug 31, 2001
14,572
203
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The Keebler Factory
The 1% is in denial, they can't accept that the working class now views technology as The Antichrist.
Tell that to the hundreds of millions of people addicted to their smartphones.

Fact: The younger you are, the more you embrace technology. Working class people are (rightly) scared of their jobs being taken replaced by AI and other technologies. But to say they view technology as the antichrist is alarmist and factually wrong. Quite the opposite, they love technology. Just not when it threatens THEIR job.
 

WarGames

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Mar 26, 2018
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It wasn't opposition from residents, it was opposition from AOC. She thought that the 3B, was money they had to give. She commented on Yahoo with suggestions of what they should do with it rather than give it to Amazon; said if state/city was willing to "give away $3 billion for this deal," investments can be made in hiring teachers and fixing the subway.

She doesn't understand that tax breaks are not subsidies or grants. No money is given to the company through the government. She also missed the part where you can't spend money that was planned to not be taken from a company.

What NY missed out on? 25,000 * $150,000 year headquarter jobs. Given NYs high income tax rate 3.5Billion would be covered in no time. This was in NYC boundaries so city incomes taxes gone, property taxes gone, sales taxes and shoppers gone. This is why NY has lost more people than any other state.

How she graduated with an international economics degree and STILL doesn't understand the difference between giving money away vs tax incentives is a mystery to me.
 

Darts

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2017
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It wasn't opposition from residents, it was opposition from AOC. She thought that the 3B, was money they had to give.
Can't get much dumber than that. Maybe they can create more money by not giving tax incentives to companies to not locate in NYC.

This is why NY has lost more people than any other state.
Actually, New York is in a race with California (another lefty state) to see who can win the most people lost race.
 

james t kirk

Well-known member
Aug 17, 2001
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Amazon will become the new Walmart.

Remember about 10 or 15 years ago when a lot of people were boycotting Walmart, or doing their best to prevent Walmarts from opening up in their area. Remember when Walmart wanted to open up a store in Kensington Market in Toronto and people went nuts and the politicians got in on the act and helped spike it?

Amazon is heading that way.

They use and abuse their employees and they are killing more small merchants (and big ones too) than Walmart ever could have dreamed about. People just are too stupid (yet) to put 2 and 2 together that Amazon is far more evil than Walmart. At least Walmart contributes to the communities that buy from them as opposed to Amazon, which just ships goods from a few key warehouses scattered around the countries. (Ooops, did I say Warehouses, I guess I should have said "fulfillment centres". My bad.)
 

james t kirk

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Aug 17, 2001
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It wasn't opposition from residents, it was opposition from AOC. She thought that the 3B, was money they had to give. She commented on Yahoo with suggestions of what they should do with it rather than give it to Amazon; said if state/city was willing to "give away $3 billion for this deal," investments can be made in hiring teachers and fixing the subway.

She doesn't understand that tax breaks are not subsidies or grants. No money is given to the company through the government. She also missed the part where you can't spend money that was planned to not be taken from a company.

What NY missed out on? 25,000 * $150,000 year headquarter jobs. Given NYs high income tax rate 3.5Billion would be covered in no time. This was in NYC boundaries so city incomes taxes gone, property taxes gone, sales taxes and shoppers gone. This is why NY has lost more people than any other state.

How she graduated with an international economics degree and STILL doesn't understand the difference between giving money away vs tax incentives is a mystery to me.
See, in my books, if the government gives them "tax breaks" and all kinds of other breaks, it adds up to 3 billion dollars, it's money out of the government's pockets. I COSTS the city 3 billions dollars. Whether it's front end, or back end, the results are the same. 3 billion dollars out of the government's pockets. Reminds me of these red neck american cities that will spend 750 million tax dollars they don't have to build a stadium for one NFL team or another (or baseball team) because they think that it will contribute to the local economy. Well, that kinds of foolishness never quite pans out or adds up. The local municipalities usually get fuck all out of the deal other than having an NFL team play in their town. (Yay, a bunch of multimillionaires running around on a field owned by a billionaire.)
 

Darts

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Jan 15, 2017
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I think some things in life are inevitable. Example: It was Kodak that invented digital photography but they kept it in the closet to "protect" their film business. Kodak is now bankrupt and all those mom and pop print shops are gone.

Anyway, I hope NYC will spend that $3 billion they "saved" wisely. Did AOC say what she would do with the $3 billion she saved?

Lud·dite
Dictionary result for Luddite
/ˈlədˌīt/
noun
plural noun: Luddites

1.
derogatory
a person opposed to new technology or ways of working.
"a small-minded Luddite resisting progress"
2.
historical
a member of any of the bands of English workers who destroyed machinery, especially in cotton and woolen mills, that they believed was threatening their jobs (1811–16).

Origin
early 19th century: perhaps named after Ned Lud, a participant in the destruction of machinery, + -ite1.
Translate luddites to
Use over time for: luddites
 

Malibuk

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Jan 9, 2017
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See, in my books, if the government gives them "tax breaks" and all kinds of other breaks, it adds up to 3 billion dollars, it's money out of the government's pockets. I COSTS the city 3 billions dollars. Whether it's front end, or back end, the results are the same. 3 billion dollars out of the government's pockets.
It`s not like there are so many companies like Amazon and not enough room for all of them.
So instead of filling one of the limited spots with a company that will get 3b in subsidies, just pick one of the other ones who will come with no incentives?

3b in incentives does not mean that they now pay nothing.
How much taxes would the 25k employees pay?
How much economic activity/taxes/jobs would have been generated when the 25k employees spent their money?
And the businesses and people receiving this money would in turn spend it, and so on.
I am not saying get them at any cost but this decision looks very stupid to me.
 

Darts

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Jan 15, 2017
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"Mayor Bill de Blasio (D-NY) ripped into Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY) for her role in killing the deal to bring Amazon to Queens.

During an appearance on WNYC radio this week, the mayor said, “As a progressive my entire life — and I ain’t changing — I’ll take on any progressive anywhere that thinks it’s a good idea to lose jobs and revenue because I think that’s out of touch with what working people want.”

“I came up watching the mistakes of progressives of the past, unfortunately what happened in this city when it almost went to bankruptcy in the 1970s,” a furious de Blasio added. “I saw all the times progressives did not show people effective governance and all the times progressives made the kinds of mistakes that alienated working people.”

“Working people are very smart and very discerning. They want jobs, they want revenue, they want the kinds of things that government can do for them,” he said. “They understand they have to be paid for.”

This week, Ocasio-Cortez cheered the news that Amazon pulled out of a deal that promised 25,000 high-paying jobs for her constituents and at least $25 billion in additional tax revenue over ten years.

“Anything is possible,” she tweeted.“Today was a day a group of dedicated, everyday New Yorkers & their neighbors defeated Amazon’s corporate greed, its worker exploitation, and the power of the richest man in the world.”

The only problem with that is that she later proved she had no concept of how the deal was set up. “We were subsidizing those jobs,” she told reporters, adding that if the state/city was willing to “give away $3 billion for this deal,” those investments can, instead, be made in hiring teachers and fixing the subway.

Here’s the full quote:

So I firmly believe that if we want to take that $3 billion dollars that we were willing to give to Amazon and invest it in our local community, we can do that. We can make those jobs. We can make 25,000 jobs. But we don’t have to give away and allow our subway system to crumble so that Amazon essentially owns a part of New York City. We can create 25,000 jobs with Mom-and-Pops; we can create 25,000 jobs with companies that are willing to come to the table, but we should not be giving away our infrastructure, our subway system, our schools, our teachers’ salaries, our firefighters’ budgets, to a company that has not shown good faith to New Yorkers. And we can ask for more because we deserve more.

Except that is not at all how the deal was structured. There was no giveaway. The $3 billion was a tax cut, was New York allowing Amazon to keep its own money. In other words,

Now, as I argued on Friday, there is a case to be made against this kind of crony capitalism, these carveouts where the government picks winners and losers. I am not a big fan of the gentrification that would have certainly come with Amazon’s massive campus on Long Island City, Queens. But I am also willing to admit I’m a middle-aged fuddy-duddy who hates change.

But that this deal overall was a good one for New York is not in dispute. There is also no doubt the people of New York, including Ocasio-Cortez’s own constituents in the Queens area that would have been most affected by it, wanted the deal. But she blew it…

And when a Bill de Blasio is complaining about someone being too far to the left, that is really something.

In her defense, though, it could just be that she’s an idiot."

If you are CEO of a company would you really want to move to NYC and waste your time having to deal with people like AOC? Amazon had over a 100 suitors (prettiest girl at the dance).
 

Darts

Well-known member
Jan 15, 2017
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One Court Square
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Court_Square

It's actually a good location for business meetings. I remember flying into La Guardia and be able to get to my meeting without getting stuck in a tunnel crossing into Manhattan. Not sure now, but the area was really desolated. No nice hotels or restaurants.

If I stayed over I would have had to book a hotel room in Manhattan and take the subway to get there. As a young man at that time I made sure I visited the fleshpots, restaurants, theaters around Times Square.
 

Polaris

Well-known member
Oct 11, 2007
3,076
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hornyville
"Mayor Bill de Blasio (D-NY) ripped into Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez (D-NY) for her role in killing the deal to bring Amazon to Queens.
Unbelievable!

AOC is dumb as anyone.

That is why she really scares me. In America, the only thing that matters is if it sells. She actually sold this and people bought it up. Even though she is dumb as a rock, she still could be president if she can sell. This episode proves she sell anything.

I will prove how dumb this rejection of this deal is right here right now.

There will be some math, which will hurt the brain of a real Liberal and leftist.

The deal is AMZN comes in, The Borough of Queens grants a tax break of X number of years.

Therefore if AMZN invests, The Queens after X number of years will start reaping in some additional tax revenue. Along with other benefits of having such capital expenditure in the city, and all with all the jobs created.

Now look at this another way. Suppose AMZN does not come in, therefore no tax break is needed. After X number of years, The Queens, is still The Queens.

In the first outcome, The Queens gives up nothing for something.

In the second outcome, The Queens gives up nothing for nothing.

That is why AOC will be president of America one day. If she can sell this, she can sell anything.

:pizza:
 

nottyboi

Well-known member
May 14, 2008
22,447
1,325
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It wasn't opposition from residents, it was opposition from AOC. She thought that the 3B, was money they had to give. She commented on Yahoo with suggestions of what they should do with it rather than give it to Amazon; said if state/city was willing to "give away $3 billion for this deal," investments can be made in hiring teachers and fixing the subway.

She doesn't understand that tax breaks are not subsidies or grants. No money is given to the company through the government. She also missed the part where you can't spend money that was planned to not be taken from a company.

What NY missed out on? 25,000 * $150,000 year headquarter jobs. Given NYs high income tax rate 3.5Billion would be covered in no time. This was in NYC boundaries so city incomes taxes gone, property taxes gone, sales taxes and shoppers gone. This is why NY has lost more people than any other state.

How she graduated with an international economics degree and STILL doesn't understand the difference between giving money away vs tax incentives is a mystery to me.
Problem with giving Amazon huge tax breaks is they are wiping out retail jobs and even competitors all over the USA. So you are subsidizing one company to wipe out more jobs then they create.
 

Smallcock

Active member
Jun 5, 2009
13,703
21
38
I think some things in life are inevitable. Example: It was Kodak that invented digital photography but they kept it in the closet to "protect" their film business. Kodak is now bankrupt and all those mom and pop print shops are gone.

Anyway, I hope NYC will spend that $3 billion they "saved" wisely. Did AOC say what she would do with the $3 billion she saved?
AOC is such a generic know-nothing.

 

wigglee

Well-known member
Oct 13, 2010
9,819
1,603
113
Amazon will become the new Walmart.

Remember about 10 or 15 years ago when a lot of people were boycotting Walmart, or doing their best to prevent Walmarts from opening up in their area. Remember when Walmart wanted to open up a store in Kensington Market in Toronto and people went nuts and the politicians got in on the act and helped spike it?

Amazon is heading that way.

They use and abuse their employees and they are killing more small merchants (and big ones too) than Walmart ever could have dreamed about. People just are too stupid (yet) to put 2 and 2 together that Amazon is far more evil than Walmart. At least Walmart contributes to the communities that buy from them as opposed to Amazon, which just ships goods from a few key warehouses scattered around the countries. (Ooops, did I say Warehouses, I guess I should have said "fulfillment centres". My bad.)
Nice try James, but Amazon literally owns the internet in terms of the rapidly expanding field of selling and delivering stuff, and they sell every kind of "stuff". Are you jealous that Jeff is over 40 times richer than your hero Donald?
 

WarGames

Banned
Mar 26, 2018
731
0
16
See, in my books, if the government gives them "tax breaks" and all kinds of other breaks, it adds up to 3 billion dollars, it's money out of the government's pockets. I COSTS the city 3 billions dollars. Whether it's front end, or back end, the results are the same. 3 billion dollars out of the government's pockets. Reminds me of these red neck american cities that will spend 750 million tax dollars they don't have to build a stadium for one NFL team or another (or baseball team) because they think that it will contribute to the local economy. Well, that kinds of foolishness never quite pans out or adds up. The local municipalities usually get fuck all out of the deal other than having an NFL team play in their town. (Yay, a bunch of multimillionaires running around on a field owned by a billionaire.)
I know James, in your books it's also okay for SNC to lobby the Canadian government to have the Canadian Criminal Code changed to help get SNC off on corruption and fraud charges because there's 50k jobs on the line, with only 8k that are in Canada.

Stay away from business lol
 

WarGames

Banned
Mar 26, 2018
731
0
16
Problem with giving Amazon huge tax breaks is they are wiping out retail jobs and even competitors all over the USA. So you are subsidizing one company to wipe out more jobs then they create.
What tech companies are in NY??
 
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