Nope. Not mocking him. I agree he is being generous in his help. I want to know the answer. How long does it take to get results? I want to know if it is worth it for me
Internet dating sites
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How long till results is an impossible question to answer since it depends. If you young and handsome probably far less than old Dave here looking for younger women. It all depends on luck of connecting with the right women and on dating sites its a long process usually. They don't have bookers to call and set up an appointment, like we are spoilled by with escort agencies !
Ok - long post: here is my confessional/experience with Internet dating sites. I suspect that many married/divorced guys on Terb may relate.
Background: I was married for over 20 years. My ex-wife was very attractive, aged better than me (helped by plastic surgery/botox/fake tits), and loved sex. So what was the problem? Me. I went one year before cheating. I was not good at monogamy and used hobbying as a safe, harm free way to satisfy a need. I loved my wife for many years, was a good husband in every other respect and a good, devoted Dad for our kids. But I was shitty at the faithful husband aspect. I worked in a high stress job and felt that I needed, deserved and had earned a stress relief - quick, mid-day or after work sex was it. Sometimes 2 or 3 times a week. Fast forward to the present. Any mid-50's guy can relate to the fact that when you look in the mirror or get together with buddies or admire woman you are NOT doing this with the mindset of a 50 something. In fact, when I get together with buddies - we joke around and act like the same idiots we were over 35 years ago. Except now we're dirty old men. In sports its the same thing - My body is older but my brain doesn't know it. Last year, I bought something from Shoppers and the girl gave me the Seniors discount without me asking. It was an eye-opener!!
All of this delusion/denial relates to my internet dating experience. I tried Match and PoF for a while - maybe a year during the separation/divorce. Immediately the problem surfaced that most of the women I would automatically look twice at were looking for men at least 10 - 20 years younger than me. There were women in my age cohort who were attractive but these were few and far between - that's how shallow I am... LOL. And all the inquiries I received were from women roughly my age - oddly enough, there were no 20 something bombshells looking for a past-middle-aged guy with a body type "average" (which means a few extra pounds). [Actually that's not completely true. I got 3 or 4 inquiries from young women who looked like models. Gorgeous!! Problem is, they all lived in the US, but were moving to Toronto in the near future and happened to stumble upon my profile. They ALL wanted to meet me and if I wanted to see them for a weekend I just had to send money for their plane ticket!!!! LOL!] Anyway, went on many dates and some were awkward disappointments and a few worked out for repeat dates. My first civilian make-out session after 20 plus years of marriage was super-awkward - my ex-wife and I knew each other so well that we had a sort of natural rhythm. And again, the shallow things bothered me. Even though I'm probably 10 - 15 pounds overweight myself - I don't like to see a loose belly, or cellulite in a woman (talk about a double standard). So there were a couple times where intimacy was a problem even when I found them attractive in clothing. And as pathetic as it sounds - I even faked ED once. In that sense, hobbying may have spoiled me forever. Anyway, long story short after meeting maybe 8 - 9 different women, only 1 worked out where there was a true mutual attraction and we got along for what might have been a longer term thing. Meanwhile, I continued to hobby, and kind of blew it on purpose by neglecting to call for an extended period. Now I'm taking a break. Net net, hobbying is cheaper and sexually way more satisfying. Maybe I'll mature one day.
As far as comparisons go (and I think both Match and PoF are owned by the same parent) - I found that Match has more dishonest profiles and people who use way out of date pictures. And some real whacko's - too. PoF seemed to have more genuine, down to earth women looking for relationships - so is less flash and more desperation. The search engine is far from perfect. Eg: I would receive matches that matched MY criteria but I would not necessarily match theirs. So that wastes time. I had more dates from Match but quickly learned that: Ages are generally fudged. Body type is too. "Athletic and toned" usually means "average" and "average" usually means "a few extra pounds". And claims to be "happily divorced" is bullshit. Every women I met bitched about their ex in some way. I found the "hit" ratio to be about 5 to one when responding to a profile and out of that - 5 hits may result in a one date. So it's like any sales effort - lots of misses and you need a thick skin and you can't be afraid of rejection and failure. And you'll see many of the same profiles being recycled with new stories and the same pictures - people adjust their profiles based upon response - I did the same thing. So somebody you passed on earlier, may show up again in your matches.
Oh and funny story: Early on when I had just joined Match - I was browsing and came upon a vaguely familiar face who was a former friend from my high school who was now divorced and who (according to her profile age) must have been 6 years old when we were in grade 13 together. I sent her a message and we had a good laugh and actually met for coffee to trade stories. She had some horror stories - I think women get scammed on these sites far more than men. Normally I would have asked her out for a date - but man, did we feel and look old!!
Background: I was married for over 20 years. My ex-wife was very attractive, aged better than me (helped by plastic surgery/botox/fake tits), and loved sex. So what was the problem? Me. I went one year before cheating. I was not good at monogamy and used hobbying as a safe, harm free way to satisfy a need. I loved my wife for many years, was a good husband in every other respect and a good, devoted Dad for our kids. But I was shitty at the faithful husband aspect. I worked in a high stress job and felt that I needed, deserved and had earned a stress relief - quick, mid-day or after work sex was it. Sometimes 2 or 3 times a week. Fast forward to the present. Any mid-50's guy can relate to the fact that when you look in the mirror or get together with buddies or admire woman you are NOT doing this with the mindset of a 50 something. In fact, when I get together with buddies - we joke around and act like the same idiots we were over 35 years ago. Except now we're dirty old men. In sports its the same thing - My body is older but my brain doesn't know it. Last year, I bought something from Shoppers and the girl gave me the Seniors discount without me asking. It was an eye-opener!!
All of this delusion/denial relates to my internet dating experience. I tried Match and PoF for a while - maybe a year during the separation/divorce. Immediately the problem surfaced that most of the women I would automatically look twice at were looking for men at least 10 - 20 years younger than me. There were women in my age cohort who were attractive but these were few and far between - that's how shallow I am... LOL. And all the inquiries I received were from women roughly my age - oddly enough, there were no 20 something bombshells looking for a past-middle-aged guy with a body type "average" (which means a few extra pounds). [Actually that's not completely true. I got 3 or 4 inquiries from young women who looked like models. Gorgeous!! Problem is, they all lived in the US, but were moving to Toronto in the near future and happened to stumble upon my profile. They ALL wanted to meet me and if I wanted to see them for a weekend I just had to send money for their plane ticket!!!! LOL!] Anyway, went on many dates and some were awkward disappointments and a few worked out for repeat dates. My first civilian make-out session after 20 plus years of marriage was super-awkward - my ex-wife and I knew each other so well that we had a sort of natural rhythm. And again, the shallow things bothered me. Even though I'm probably 10 - 15 pounds overweight myself - I don't like to see a loose belly, or cellulite in a woman (talk about a double standard). So there were a couple times where intimacy was a problem even when I found them attractive in clothing. And as pathetic as it sounds - I even faked ED once. In that sense, hobbying may have spoiled me forever. Anyway, long story short after meeting maybe 8 - 9 different women, only 1 worked out where there was a true mutual attraction and we got along for what might have been a longer term thing. Meanwhile, I continued to hobby, and kind of blew it on purpose by neglecting to call for an extended period. Now I'm taking a break. Net net, hobbying is cheaper and sexually way more satisfying. Maybe I'll mature one day.
As far as comparisons go (and I think both Match and PoF are owned by the same parent) - I found that Match has more dishonest profiles and people who use way out of date pictures. And some real whacko's - too. PoF seemed to have more genuine, down to earth women looking for relationships - so is less flash and more desperation. The search engine is far from perfect. Eg: I would receive matches that matched MY criteria but I would not necessarily match theirs. So that wastes time. I had more dates from Match but quickly learned that: Ages are generally fudged. Body type is too. "Athletic and toned" usually means "average" and "average" usually means "a few extra pounds". And claims to be "happily divorced" is bullshit. Every women I met bitched about their ex in some way. I found the "hit" ratio to be about 5 to one when responding to a profile and out of that - 5 hits may result in a one date. So it's like any sales effort - lots of misses and you need a thick skin and you can't be afraid of rejection and failure. And you'll see many of the same profiles being recycled with new stories and the same pictures - people adjust their profiles based upon response - I did the same thing. So somebody you passed on earlier, may show up again in your matches.
Oh and funny story: Early on when I had just joined Match - I was browsing and came upon a vaguely familiar face who was a former friend from my high school who was now divorced and who (according to her profile age) must have been 6 years old when we were in grade 13 together. I sent her a message and we had a good laugh and actually met for coffee to trade stories. She had some horror stories - I think women get scammed on these sites far more than men. Normally I would have asked her out for a date - but man, did we feel and look old!!
Until I met someone? Not that many. It just took many dates before I found someone with whom I had great chemistry with.
According to a 2009 study from the University of Waterloo, there is one thing you can keep in mind above all else to help you make a great impression and get the people you meet to like you right away. If you go into an encounter with a new person thinking that person will like you, they probably will. Ta-da! Ah, the power of self-confidence.
Anticipating someone is going to like you can act as a self-fulfilling prophecy. As the authors explain, "If people expect acceptance, they will behave warmly, which in turn will lead other people to accept them; if they expect rejection, they will behave coldly, which will lead to less acceptance."
I guess I wasn't able to pick up the inflection of your voice. I might need a new computer monitor for that.
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If you do the 5 minute thing be prepared to entertain her for 5 minutes. Memorize a routine.
IE: You already made her laugh, so say something intellectual that you have prepared etc. Eventually take out a notepad and pretend to start checking stuff off and say "made her laugh, showed her how smart I am, did that did that did that .... oh yeah now i gotta show you how romantic I am. This is the easy part"
Talk her into closing her eyes. Rub some oil that has a smell (lavender, orange etc) unto your palms. Tell her to breath deep then wave your hands in front of her face. Have her open her eyes then say something prepared as you lighty touch her hair and lazer her eyes to yours
IE
"A woman is to be played like a maestro plays the Stradivarius. He closes his eyes. He softly searches its heart for that perfect note. Her skin color tells him how to proceed.
The fiery blush of a rose calls for the lust of a wave crashing to the shore floating the foamy fullness of passion to the surface. When he finds that perfect note, she cannot help but release it . For that is why she lives.
I wonder, does the violin feel the same rapture as the violinist when he coaxes that single perfect note from its heart? "
Then you say " 5 minutes are up. How did I do?"
IE: You already made her laugh, so say something intellectual that you have prepared etc. Eventually take out a notepad and pretend to start checking stuff off and say "made her laugh, showed her how smart I am, did that did that did that .... oh yeah now i gotta show you how romantic I am. This is the easy part"
Talk her into closing her eyes. Rub some oil that has a smell (lavender, orange etc) unto your palms. Tell her to breath deep then wave your hands in front of her face. Have her open her eyes then say something prepared as you lighty touch her hair and lazer her eyes to yours
IE
"A woman is to be played like a maestro plays the Stradivarius. He closes his eyes. He softly searches its heart for that perfect note. Her skin color tells him how to proceed.
The fiery blush of a rose calls for the lust of a wave crashing to the shore floating the foamy fullness of passion to the surface. When he finds that perfect note, she cannot help but release it . For that is why she lives.
I wonder, does the violin feel the same rapture as the violinist when he coaxes that single perfect note from its heart? "
Then you say " 5 minutes are up. How did I do?"
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Ha ha, you talk about playing these ladies like a violin, but you have to pay to play whether the ladies are civilian or pros. You take these women for fools do you?
You know what they say, "youth is wasted on the young" .
Great story. If I were you, I'd try to get back with your ex.
NFW!! My ex was super high maintenance and I swear had NPD (which really came out during the divorce... LOL!). I’m generally a pretty happy guy but she had a knack for seeing the negative side of everything. Even after having kids - it’s like she resented that she was no longer the center of attention. I really did not like her at all towards the end. Post divorce - I’m happier, the kids are happier - my ex is as happy as she will ever allow herself. In truth, the only thing I miss are her blowjobs - always good but through my subtle coaching they became “Daphne” (ex-Mirage) and “Jayden” quality bj’s - my gold standard!! (I think I may have a sex addiction...LOL!)
There are some really good posts on this thread about the dating sites, and for those that I was personally familiar with, I agree with the information others have provided.
The only point I wanted to add was the best dating service for me was simply letting all the women in my life (wives of friends, acquaintances in the work world, women connected to any recreation I was involved with) know I was single and looking to date new people. Not for the purpose of dating any of those women, but to plug into their social circles. Almost every woman has some friend who she thinks is great, but she just can't meet a nice guy (whatever that might mean). Because there was always some sort of ongoing relationship to maintain between myself and the "matchmaker", I found that they seldom steered me to someone I found totally unacceptable. Of course, those dates didn't ultimately turn into a long term relationship, but they were all fairly enjoyable, not all that much work, and in many cases turned into other good relationships (apart from dating) because of our common contacts. (And of course, the way I met my current wife was so unpredictable that there would be no point suggesting that anyone try to replicate the circumstances. Isn't that the way these things ultimately go?!)
Ultimately, my best advice for anyone still looking for a long term relationship is just remember that there will be good times and bad. You can't invest your entire prospect of happiness in any relationship. Become happy with your life, and let relationships happen if they feel right, but never feel that they are necessary to your happiness.
If you are JUST looking to get laid by hot girls, the hobby makes FAR more sense in terms of time, money, and BS management.
The only point I wanted to add was the best dating service for me was simply letting all the women in my life (wives of friends, acquaintances in the work world, women connected to any recreation I was involved with) know I was single and looking to date new people. Not for the purpose of dating any of those women, but to plug into their social circles. Almost every woman has some friend who she thinks is great, but she just can't meet a nice guy (whatever that might mean). Because there was always some sort of ongoing relationship to maintain between myself and the "matchmaker", I found that they seldom steered me to someone I found totally unacceptable. Of course, those dates didn't ultimately turn into a long term relationship, but they were all fairly enjoyable, not all that much work, and in many cases turned into other good relationships (apart from dating) because of our common contacts. (And of course, the way I met my current wife was so unpredictable that there would be no point suggesting that anyone try to replicate the circumstances. Isn't that the way these things ultimately go?!)
Ultimately, my best advice for anyone still looking for a long term relationship is just remember that there will be good times and bad. You can't invest your entire prospect of happiness in any relationship. Become happy with your life, and let relationships happen if they feel right, but never feel that they are necessary to your happiness.
If you are JUST looking to get laid by hot girls, the hobby makes FAR more sense in terms of time, money, and BS management.
Like your five minute idea, but the scented oil and the rehearsed violin line, while well written, seems like something best left for later in an established relationship. Might work with some but scare some off most thinking "who is this Romeo with his rehearsed lines?"
I don't pretend to have a better routine. It harder to navigate with verbal communication since social media came along.
I was on POF and only had positive experiences, probably dated about 40 women on there, my wife being the last one. We have a great relationship and two wonderful kids. I never dated anyone so perfect for me.
The other ladies where also pretty good. But I learned to avoid the ones with their longest relationship being 1 year or less and in their 30s. Unless they are Doctors or Engineers, no excuse for having such short relationships.
They also happen to be very attractive with major daddy issues. They usually have a line like "are there any good men left", "will a man restore my faith in men", etc. Daddy broke them and only he can undo the damage.
Also, I met my first wife on Lava life, its something else now. We had 3 kids together and we are still best of friends.
I recommend online dating over bar pick ups.
But take the time to read the profiles and analyze what people write. They tell you so much about their real selves, without them knowing.
Most importantly dont take things personally, and you have to be an Alfa male. Fake it to you make...
Do a search for how to be a badass.
There is no true technique for picking up women that will work every time. But one technique that was very successful for me was learning to make two faces.
The first a mean face, as soon as I would like a woman i make a mean or serious face until she would look away. Then I would wait for her to look back, at which point I would flash her a huge smile. If they smile back I would approach them and introduce my self.
If you have a problem with conversations, the key is to practice with strangers. Example when you get a coffe find three personal things about the person serving you. Like favorite colour, horoscope sign, favorite holiday etc. Do this every day every chance you get. In a couple of months you will be an expert at reading people and having conversations.
Remember that you will fail more than you will succeed at first, but ones you find your grove and what works for you, your success rate will be much better.
Best pick up places i found to be book stores, and hotel bars. Specially by the Airport (flight attendants) or Downtown Toronto (business women) look for the ones sitting alone.
Lastly this is what i mean about mean face and smile. Works even when you are not good looking and all they will remember is the smile you flashed them and how your eyes sparkled.
The first a mean face, as soon as I would like a woman i make a mean or serious face until she would look away. Then I would wait for her to look back, at which point I would flash her a huge smile. If they smile back I would approach them and introduce my self.
If you have a problem with conversations, the key is to practice with strangers. Example when you get a coffe find three personal things about the person serving you. Like favorite colour, horoscope sign, favorite holiday etc. Do this every day every chance you get. In a couple of months you will be an expert at reading people and having conversations.
Remember that you will fail more than you will succeed at first, but ones you find your grove and what works for you, your success rate will be much better.
Best pick up places i found to be book stores, and hotel bars. Specially by the Airport (flight attendants) or Downtown Toronto (business women) look for the ones sitting alone.
Lastly this is what i mean about mean face and smile. Works even when you are not good looking and all they will remember is the smile you flashed them and how your eyes sparkled.
Forgot to mention, never take dating tips from women. Reason being is that every woman us different and unique. So what one wants is not what the other wants
This will sound bad in todays society, but it was true for our grand fathers and its true today.
You have to be the Alfa and the man of the relationship. There is no equality in the relationship. Women wamt men to be strong and confident. When she says she wants a sensitive man, she doesn't want you to be a wimp and cry. She wants you to be sensitive to her needs. Her pillar of strength.
Equality only occurs outside the relationship, your wife or girlfriend can be super successful, the CEO of your company, your boss, chief surgeon at sick kids, or the worlds top architect, what ever her goals are, and you will be very supportive of her succes. But in the relationship between the two of you away from outside world, you are the man and the alfa male.
That will keep her interested in you and give you a successful relationship.
This will sound bad in todays society, but it was true for our grand fathers and its true today.
You have to be the Alfa and the man of the relationship. There is no equality in the relationship. Women wamt men to be strong and confident. When she says she wants a sensitive man, she doesn't want you to be a wimp and cry. She wants you to be sensitive to her needs. Her pillar of strength.
Equality only occurs outside the relationship, your wife or girlfriend can be super successful, the CEO of your company, your boss, chief surgeon at sick kids, or the worlds top architect, what ever her goals are, and you will be very supportive of her succes. But in the relationship between the two of you away from outside world, you are the man and the alfa male.
That will keep her interested in you and give you a successful relationship.
I do not mean to tread on what works for you, but I would avoid a huge smile . You do not know her so why would you be so happy to see her? A huge smile might make her defensive. Instead, smirk. A smirk is a half smile. It says I am confident, mysterious and sexy.
Practice in a mirror until you get your smirk (or smile) perfected. You want a friendly look, not a cocky one. Go get some photos done for social media. Do several smirks and let the photographer give you directions so you can learn which one is best for you. Best photos come at end of session because you become more relaxed.
Here are a couple of celebs with a smirk. They were in the photo shoot for hours until they perfected it. You must do the same work.
Smirks are fun to give. George Clooney has a great smirk and so do most leading men. They know it works with the ladies. Notice how smiles through his eyes.
More fun to receive and a great way to get a guy to come over. I wish more girls would learn to do it. What straight guy ( or lesbian) could resist Emma Watson with her delicious smiirk? So incredibly friendly, mysterious and sexy . Notice the tilt of the head towards you and folded arms exuding confidence.
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For years plenty of fish was 100% totally free, it's only been the last 5 years or so where they started to charge.
