Looks like NAFTA has stalled out. Word is Canada is demanding protection from the section 232 national security law that Trump has uses to impose tariffs willy nilly. I do agree if there is no additional "certainty" created by NAFTA II then it is pretty worthless to Canada. Not sure how this will work.
NAFTA stalled out
- Thread starter nottyboi
- Start date
I have refrained form commenting on this topic, simply because I do not know about the high-level economics going on. However, I think that we need to be defending our sovereign rights as Canada. We need to stick to our guns as a sovereign nation. Trump is NOT our president, nor does he have the right to dictate to us what we can and cannot do as a country. I suspect that we will probably suffer if we don't sign on to NAFTA, in the short term, as will the USA. However, in the long term, we will probably do well. And that is what counts, the long term.
The proverbial white flag from a PM who can't negotiate his way out of a women's prison with a handful of pardons.
I don't see a white flag, only the Mexicans waved a white flag. Canada is actually demanding additional protection against the use of tariffs on national securty grounds. Trump has CLEARLY abused this law, so they are right to demand protection from it. Without this, the agreement is worthless anyway.
Junior and his gang of incompetents were out manoeuvred by a classic divide & conquer business tactic by Trump. He worked a deal out with Mexico which basically put Canada as the take it or leave it outsider.
So the solution at this point is to piss off the US even more? That should turn out well.
Canada should have been way ahead of this but instead, Mr. Trust Fund Boy was too busy jet-setting around the world on vacation and costume parties.
Thank god he'll be gone soon.
Mexico caved in as they have a spineless leader. Canada is doing what is right for the Canadians. If these right wing traitors who live here cannot accept it then they can piss off and move to the USA. Not long to go before the Senate switches hands and then they will reject the bilateral deal, as they are aware as to the damage that the second biggest trading partner offers their nation. Trump the idiot just cannot understand that the Canadian Dairy industry is crumbs in comparison to the volume of goods and services moving between the two nations. Anyway, now Mexico has finally decided to back a separate trade deal with Canada if NAFTA talks do fail. No doubt Canada can then ship the Canadian their goods via Mexico for a start:
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/wor...h-canada-if-nafta-talks-fail-president-elect/
In some ways the failure of NAFTA would be the best thing for Canada.
We will reestablish the system we had in place before NAFTA when dealing with the USA. In many ways, hell, all ways, we have been taking the easy road in bedding down with the Americans for too long. We can establish free trade agreements with the rest of the world and see how it goes with the Americans. The rest of the world is ganging up on Trump anyway. Trump can crow away about his deal making prowess, however, someone will eventually notice that he made a deal only with Mexico, the very country that is stealing industry and jobs away from Americans. It's very strange to me that any American would think a free trade deal with Mexico is a good thing.
I remember Pat Buchanan ranting and raving years ago against NAFTA. He specifically said that free trade with Mexico was a disaster because it was taking jobs away from Americans, however free trade with Canada was great because it would take jobs away from Canadians. And now Trump is saying the exact. Makes no sense.
Also, I recently found out that Americans are more heavily invested in Canada than any other country in the world. In fact, no other country comes close. So these American investors will suffer the consequences.
Canada needs to build economic relationships with other countries around the globe and Cadet Bonespurs is providing the impetus.
We will reestablish the system we had in place before NAFTA when dealing with the USA. In many ways, hell, all ways, we have been taking the easy road in bedding down with the Americans for too long. We can establish free trade agreements with the rest of the world and see how it goes with the Americans. The rest of the world is ganging up on Trump anyway. Trump can crow away about his deal making prowess, however, someone will eventually notice that he made a deal only with Mexico, the very country that is stealing industry and jobs away from Americans. It's very strange to me that any American would think a free trade deal with Mexico is a good thing.
I remember Pat Buchanan ranting and raving years ago against NAFTA. He specifically said that free trade with Mexico was a disaster because it was taking jobs away from Americans, however free trade with Canada was great because it would take jobs away from Canadians. And now Trump is saying the exact. Makes no sense.
Also, I recently found out that Americans are more heavily invested in Canada than any other country in the world. In fact, no other country comes close. So these American investors will suffer the consequences.
Canada needs to build economic relationships with other countries around the globe and Cadet Bonespurs is providing the impetus.
And I don't think Mexico caved at all. Quite the contrary, they made off like bandits. Mexico has been taking industry and jobs away from the Americans for 20 years now. All they wanted is to continue to do that and that's exactly what they got. Brilliant. They are not worried about dairy farmers or cultural sovereignty (They need not worry about their culture because they are so dissimilar to the USA it can't happen any way.). The Mexicans were only worried about 1 thing.......their ability to entice American companies to relocate from the USA to Mexico and on that front they won hands down.
Let us be realistic. The Mexican minimum wage is $4.70 a day. They have much lower labour costs. So like China and India they are benefitting from such low wages in comparison to the US.
That is why jobs are moving there. No doubt they caved in on the fact that there are quotas as to the number of cars that can be built at such low rates.
That is why jobs are moving there. No doubt they caved in on the fact that there are quotas as to the number of cars that can be built at such low rates.
The auto industry is not going to wait until 2020
They will have to react to events in order to survive
The americans will tool up south of the boarder to avoid the tariffs on canadian parts
They will not give that back
I think the situation right now is kind of dire.
The risks, are extreme.
Yet this NAFTA story is under-reported by the Liberal media in Canada. Seems like basic economic/financial/business literacy is close to 0% in this country.
Surely this Federal Liberal government, their knowledge is around there.
This stage of the NAFTA thing, is like taking a mortgage a partial one on your home, then taking that cash to the casino in Las Vegas. They could have taken that money to the Toronto Casino on the waterfront, which Premier Wynne rejected, who incidentally left us a budget deficit of 15 billion. Damn, that casino $$$ could have come in handy, but what can we expect with people who have 0% economic literacy.
Taking you mortgage to the casino, you can actually win! But you can lose too. But you can actually win, like a John Tory what have I accomplished list. The obvious point is to not be in such a position. Yet, here we are.
:deadhorse:
Even IF the Dems take back the House they won't negotiate because that activity belongs to the Executive Branch. And, in any case, they'll be too busy trying to get Trump and nailing him by advocating less protection for the American workers is not a strategy they'll pursue.
Simple.
If the US government puts tariffs on Canadian autos which causes manufacturers to pull out of Canada, we respond with huge tariffs against American made cars.
Example, Ford closes Ford Canada.
Fine, now every Ford coming into Canada gets hit with a 50 percent tariff.
There are still plenty of other car and truck options for the Canadian consumer. Just no more F150s.
Canada is THEE number 1 export market for American cars BY FAR. In fact, pretty much at all. How many F150s do you think the Japanese buy? Answer - 0. How many F150s do you think the Europeans buy? I will answer that too. None. How many F150s do you think the Mexicans Buy? Maybe a couple hundred.
Canada is really the ONLY export market for Ford, GM and Chrysler. No-one else in the world really wants to buy American cars. Canadians buy millions of them.
I really doubt that Ford GM and Chrysler want to give up that market. Especially when there is no real trade imbalance at all between Canada and the USA.
Killing the Canadian market for American cars at the least will only drive up car prices south of the boarder and potentially could bankrupt the US auto firms. They NEED the Canadian market.
There are really 2 impacts the US will feel if tariffs are imposed on cars coming in from Canada. First about 60% of every car manufactured in Canada is comprised of parts manufactured in the US so US car part manufacturers will suffer. Second if tariffs are imposed it will result in the cost of cars in the US going up which is in effect a tax on the American consumer. The same with Mexico. The Mexican agreement simply formalized agreement which had previously been made in terms of the percentage of cars manufactured using higher paid employees. Most had been previously compliant in any event.Again the ultimate result will be to increase the cost of cars in the US which is a tax on American consumers.
The PGOTUS does not understand the concept of tariffs as evidenced by the problems that Gary Cohen and others had in trying to explain them. His entire negotiating strategy is keep raising the stakes and the other side will blink. The problem is tht in raising the stakes it is the US consumer and manufacturers that pay. The impact is being masked by a surging stock market which does not really benefit the average American.
....and please tell us all, what are Freeland’s credentials for negotiating a trade deal? Her years as a journalist? Or perhaps her years of studying literature? Did Trudeau give any thought when he appointed this lightweight to negotiate? Despite Reisman being a liberal, Mulroney gavr the task to Simon Riesman....SOMEONE WITH KNOWLEDGE OF ECONOMICS AND A BACKGROUND IN FINANCE”. After all, he was involved in negotiating the auto pact, he was involved with GATT back in the day, he was competent and knew what he was doing. We have a collection of idiots appointed because it was 2015.
What are Doug Ford's credentials for running Ontario?
Killing his family business?
One failed term on city council?
Do you apply the same standards to those you back?
