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NFL to start fining teams when their players kneel for anthem

Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
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The NFL has finally had enough. I guess they saw attendance fall so drastically in some stadiums, they had to do something:

New NFL policy: Teams to be fined if players kneel during anthem

The NFL announced Wednesday that all players who are on the field when the national anthem is heard before a game must stand — or they can choose to remain in the locker room without penalty.

The league's teams agreed unanimously to the new policy during a spring meeting in Atlanta, and they will be subject to a fine if a player disobeys, NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell said at a news conference.

While the move is in response to dozens of players over the past year kneeling as a form of protest over social justice issues, the guidelines aren't specific about what constitutes a sign of disrespect directed toward the anthem. It was also unclear the amount of a fine.

"All 32 clubs want to make sure that during the moment of the anthem and the flag, that that is a very important moment for a lot of us as a league, as clubs and (for) our country, and it's a moment we want to make sure is done in a respectful fashion," Goodell said.

"It was unfortunate that on-field protests created a false perception among many that thousands of NFL players were unpatriotic. This is not and was never the case," the league also said in a statement announcing the new policy.

The union representing players lashed out at the league's decision, tweeting that it had not been consulted about the rule change.

"The NFL chose not to consult the union in the development of this new 'policy,'" the NFL Players Association said in its statement. "NFL players have shown their patriotism through their social activism, their community service, in support of our military and law enforcement and yes, through their protests to raise awareness about the issues they care about."

Goodell claimed hundreds of players were asked for their input.

The controversy over players kneeling during "The Star-Spangled Banner" has raged since 2016, when then-San Francisco 49ers quarterback Colin Kaepernick first refused to stand as a lone protest against police brutality and racial oppression.

Eventually, some teammates joined him. Other players didn't kneel but raised their firsts in silent solidarity.

"To me, this is bigger than football and it would be selfish on my part to look the other way," Kaepernick told NFL Media in the late summer of 2016. "There are bodies in the street and people getting paid leave and getting away with murder."

The take-a-knee movement has been criticized by President Donald Trump, who said in September that he felt "ashamed" by "disgraceful" NFL-wide protests and the disrespect being shown to U.S. military members.

And Vice President Mike Pence on Wednesday afternoon tweeted a news report about the policy change with only the comment "#Winning."

But not everyone was in support.

Former Giants defensive tackle Dominique Hamilton tweeted that the NFL remains majority black, so the power is in the players' hands: "If united and didn't take the field at all, it would upset a lot of people and a lot of executives."

Sage Rosenfels, an NFL quarterback from 2001 to 2012, mocked the league's decision by tweeting that fans shouldn't be allowed to buy stadium concessions while the anthem plays
 

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
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That has GOTTA be a slam dunk freedom of speech constitutional challenge to federal court anytime the players' union wants to make the league suck its dick!
 

essguy_

Active member
Nov 1, 2001
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It's kind of ironic that "America's Game" wants to restrict the freedom that supposedly makes America great. But it's a business so they can do whatever they want - even if this means aping any banana republic where everybody must stand and salute on command or face the consequences.
 

Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
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That has GOTTA be a slam dunk freedom of speech constitutional challenge to federal court anytime the players' union wants to make the league suck its dick!
Lets say you own a restaurant, and you hired a waiter who always wears "sieg heil Hitler" t-shirt. Would that also then not fall under a constitutional freedom of speech, or does the restaurant owner not have a right to present a certain image to his customers by enforcing a staff dress code (with no Hitler t-shirt)??

Now dont get mad (like you usually do). Take a deep breath and think about it before you answer
 

saxon

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Dec 2, 2009
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That has GOTTA be a slam dunk freedom of speech constitutional challenge to federal court anytime the players' union wants to make the league suck its dick!
No ones saying players can’t protest, they just shouldn’t be doing it on company time.
 

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
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Lets say you own a restaurant, and you hired a waiter who always wears "sieg heil Hitler" t-shirt. Would that also then not fall under a constitutional freedom of speech, or does the restaurant owner not have a right to present a certain image to his customers by enforcing a staff dress code (with no Hitler t-shirt)??

Now dont get mad (like you usually do). Take a deep breath and think about it before you answer
Say 1 dude wanted to give a Nazi salute at a football game. Weird, huh? And it offends everyone.

But an entire team wants to kneel and protest unequal racial law enforcement. You may not like it. But it's a reasonable opinion re America's present political situation. And the entire team does it. And it only takes 30 seconds. And most Blacks in America say "Yeah! Speak out!"

There's a difference, right?
 

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
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No ones saying players can’t protest, they just shouldn’t be doing it on company time.
I'm not sure. That IS their venue for making an important statement. They can kneel for the anthem in their rec room at 5AM Tuesday morning, but who is going to know.

Betcha there's a TON of US caselaw saying kids don't have to stand for the anthem in high school.
 

canada-man

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Jun 16, 2007
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Toronto, Ontario
canadianmale.wordpress.com
NFL gets billions in subsidies from U.S. taxpayers
If you're a U.S. taxpayer then you're subsidizing the wildly profitable National Football League, regardless of whether you're a fan.
The NFL is the most profitable pro sports league in the U.S., raking in an estimated $1 billion in profits on $10.5 billion in revenue last season, figures that are sure to increase this year.

Those massive profits are made possible in part by the billions of taxpayer dollars that local governments spend on teams, coupled with tax breaks worth hundreds of millions for the teams, the league, their sponsors and fans.

http://money.cnn.com/2015/01/30/news/companies/nfl-taxpayers/index.html
 

mandrill

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Aug 23, 2001
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https://www.lawyers.com/legal-info/...egiance-or-the-national-anthem-at-school.html

I was 100% correct. High school kids get to sit out the national anthem and pledge of allegiance as a constitutional right.

So let's do it this way. NFL says to players: You have to have certain political views or we will not hire you as our employees. One such view is that you suck back your constitutional right to kneel our the anthem and forego your legal right in that regard as an American citizen. I think there's a lawsuit there.

If the Dallas Cowboys were to say "We will not field any Catholics in our team, as we represent a city which is predominantly evangelical", you think that's a lawsuit for infringement of Freedom of Religion?
 

shack

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Oct 2, 2001
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I'm not sure. That IS their venue for making an important statement. They can kneel for the anthem in their rec room at 5AM Tuesday morning, but who is going to know.

Betcha there's a TON of US caselaw saying kids don't have to stand for the anthem in high school.
Actually the players can kneel during the anthem, but in the dressing room. The players are not required to be on the sidelines during the anthem. They can stay in the dressing room as a protest.

I think it is reasonable.
 

Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
25,136
3,572
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Say 1 dude wanted to give a Nazi salute at a football game. Weird, huh? And it offends everyone.

But an entire team wants to kneel and protest unequal racial law enforcement. You may not like it. But it's a reasonable opinion re America's present political situation. And the entire team does it. And it only takes 30 seconds. And most Blacks in America say "Yeah! Speak out!"

There's a difference, right?
But if an NFL owner is losing attendance and TV ratings because of the kneeling, does that owner not have a right to demand the players to stop kneeling while on company time?? Same way if a restaurant owner is losing business because nobody wants to be served by a waiter with a Hitler t-shirt.

In the end its the customer who gets to decide whats offensive, and what isnt
 

mandrill

Well-known member
Aug 23, 2001
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But if an NFL owner is losing attendance and TV ratings because of the kneeling, does that owner not have a right to demand the players to stop the kneeling while on company time?? Same way if a restaurant owner is losing business because nobody wants to be served by a waiter with a Hitler t-shirt.

In the end its the customer who gets to decide whats offensive, and what isnt
You would have a hard time proving that the teams lost $$$ due to the kneel outs. The NFL is obscenely profitable and continues to be so.
 

Phil C. McNasty

Go Jays Go
Dec 27, 2010
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You would have a hard time proving that the teams lost $$$ due to the kneel outs. The NFL is obscenely profitable and continues to be so
TV ratings were down 10% https://www.si.com/tech-media/2018/...cent-colin-kaepernick-thursday-night-football
Attendance from 2016 to 2017 was down by about half a million: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2016/attendance.htm

Yes the NFL is obviously still very profitable, but if they keep losing fans because of the kneeling protest, then for how long will they continue to be profitable??
 

essguy_

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Nov 1, 2001
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Whatever happened to the concept of "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"? It's not like kneeling was hate speech or targeted against any define-able group. This entire thing is because of a league cowed by the current President and the power he has over his dimwitted and gullible base of support. Trump, who turned a blind eye to white supremacists, but God forbid a group of black athletes visibly participate in a peaceful protest. Keep them hidden or face the wrath of Trump Nation - that Patriotic club led by a guy who sat out serving because of heel spurs and who thinks Putin is a great guy!
 

Insidious Von

My head is my home
Sep 12, 2007
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Silly argument to make.

Americans are perfectly fine with children getting slaughtered in schools yet can't tolerate football players kneeling to protest inequality and race hate? Brain dead priorities, is all I can say. Yes a waiter can wear a Hail Hitler t-shirt, he's willing to accept the consequences. Like some sick fuck grabbin him by the pussy.

Figures Generalissimo Rat Scabbie would go this route.
 

Smallcock

Active member
Jun 5, 2009
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Nobody has free reign to do as they please at work. Happy to see the NFL take an official stance.
 

Occasionally

Active member
May 22, 2011
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Haha. Good to see the owners finally win this stupid episode.

It's a game. People want to chill out on Sundays and watch two teams win a football game, and not sit there ad watch man-children turn a sporting event into a political stage.

If someone wants to protest, do it on your personal website or Twitter.

As everyone respects and expects at work, leave your politics at home.
 

tml

Well-known member
Aug 10, 2011
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No ones saying players can’t protest, they just shouldn’t be doing it on company time.
This is how I felt from the beginning. He has many avenues to express his views outside of the field. If I showed up at work with a "save the seals" message on my forehead I'd be escorted out of the building.
 
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