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Canada considering decriminalizing all drugs

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Phil C. McNasty

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Dec 27, 2010
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Its about time. I'm Dutch and not throwing junkies in jail has served as well.

Just so we're clear, decriminalization is NOT the same as legalization.
Dealing in drugs should still be an indictable offence

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...considers-decriminalization-all-illicit-drugs

Canada's Liberal party considers decriminalization of all illicit drugs

With months left before Canada becomes the first country in the G7 to fully legalise marijuana, members of the country’s Liberal party, led federally by Justin Trudeau, are calling on their government to go one step further and decriminalise the possession and consumption of all illicit drugs.

The internal push to embrace the idea is one of more than two dozen resolutions set to be debated this week as the political party gathers for their national convention in the east coast city of Halifax. The resolution is one of three put forward by the national caucus, suggesting widespread support among Liberal MPs.

“It’s one of the few issues where we’re taught from a young age, that drugs are bad and that it’s normal to throw people in jail for using drugs,” said Nathaniel Erskine-Smith, a Liberal MP who has championed decriminalisation since he was elected in 2015.

“Yet when you actually start looking underneath those claims and at the actual evidence and hear from people who have study or lived this issue, this isn’t the right approach.”
Canadian province gambles future on marijuana's 'extreme growth potential'
Read more

Framing drug use as a criminal justice issue rather than one of health has simply served to fuel a lucrative black market, divert resources from law enforcement and marginalise those who are often already on the margins of society, he argued
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apoptygma

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Portugal has done this and it has been quite successful.

I don't know if Canada is quite there yet.
 
O

Occasionally

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May 22, 2011
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Looks like he government has figured out how to control hard drugs. They just haven't told anyone yet.

Just like weed which was a sin. But the second they figure out how to control it (which probably took them decades to solve), suddenly weed isn't so bad anymore.

Booze, casinos, smokes the same thing.

First step is decriminalization of hard drugs..... and then maybe 5 years later...... Heroin safe houses, and open markets to buy this stuff from the LCBO!
 
oldjones

oldjones

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Aug 18, 2001
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And just to note: Your source said the Liberal Party was considering this move, not Canada. That was your invention.

I'd have thought you were more politically astute than those who think they're one and the same.
 
GameBoy27

GameBoy27

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I agree that drugs should be decriminalized. The time and cost for LE to bust people for simple possession is likely astronomical. Not to mention court and custody costs.

It makes way more sense to use those funds to help people seek treatment. Like mental illness, gambling etc. Drug addiction is an illness and should be treated as such.

I watched a documentary on opioid addicted teens. One girl interviewed was talking about how much she wanted to get clean. She said the problem was she couldn't seek treatment until she was clean for a week or two. (I can't remember specifically.) She said she needs help to get off the stuff. If she could stay clean for a couple weeks she wouldn't need treatment. Sounds backwards to me. So sad!
 
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onthebottom

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Opioids kill more young adults in the US than auto accidents, I’d be careful with this.
 
oldjones

oldjones

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onthebottom said:
Opioids kill more young adults in the US than auto accidents, I’d be careful with this.
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Yeah, too bad opiates — the non-industrial versions of those drugs — weren't de-criminalized before today's hopeless young folks dying from opioids — the stronger Big Pharma-produced synthetics — became a market too big for profiteering Shkreli clones to ignore. Not that pols who believe punishment is the answer to all social problems would have helped them anyway. Certainly not back then, when it might have been easier and more productive, and just as obvious punishment only makes it worse. And just guess who voted for Trump. Not that he's got the first clue what to do, but at lease he's as hopeless as they are.

The one obvious certainty is that from one border to the other American drug policies are part of the problem, and may well be an actual cause. For sure they have nothing to do with any solution. We should indeed be careful we don't follow along.
 
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Mr Deeds

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Here
VioletteDenys said:
AGREED!!

Addiction is a mental health issue, not something someone should go to jail for.
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I totally agree addicts need help and support not punishment and condemnation. Not to mention the expense of keeping them locked up.
 
mandrill

mandrill

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apoptygma said:
Portugal has done this and it has been quite successful.

I don't know if Canada is quite there yet.
Click to expand...
Not sure that Portugal is a role model. My ex bro in law went there to become a heroin and opiates addict again after staying clean for several years. He was able to become an addict again with no legal risk and died of an overdose several months later - perversely back in Ontario.

OTOH, the "War on Drugs" is unwinnable and costly. Aside from creating massive organized crime and destabilizing Latin America.

I have wondered if a registration and compulsory check-up and treatment system would work far better with dependent and frequent users than the current criminal model.
 
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Phil C. McNasty

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Mr Deeds said:
o
I totally agree addicts need help and support not punishment and condemnation. Not to mention the expense of keeping them locked up
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I just wanna add, dealing in Fentanyl should be the death penalty.

Its bad enough you're not only dealing in heroin, but when you deal in a substance that you know one extra microgram can kill your customer, you should be put to death. Sorry, there's just no compromise in my opinion
 
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Phil C. McNasty

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oagre said:
Not sure that Portugal is a role model. My ex bro in law went there to become a heroin and opiates addict again after staying clean for several years. He was able to become an addict again with no legal risk and died of an overdose several months later
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How do you know he wasnt gonna OD eventually anyways???

I'm not trying to sound like an insensitive jerk, but the question needs to be asked.


(okay, so I'm an insensitive jerk......................I'm pretty drunk too.....LOL)
 
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onthebottom

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GameBoy27 said:
So how's the long-standing war on drugs going by locking up users for simple possession?
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They don’t lock them up, they give them a shot of Narcan and an ambulance ride to the hospital or morgue.
 
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onthebottom

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oldjones said:
Yeah, too bad opiates — the non-industrial versions of those drugs — weren't de-criminalized before today's hopeless young folks dying from opioids — the stronger Big Pharma-produced synthetics — became a market too big for profiteering Shkreli clones to ignore. Not that pols who believe punishment is the answer to all social problems would have helped them anyway. Certainly not back then, when it might have been easier and more productive, and just as obvious punishment only makes it worse. And just guess who voted for Trump. Not that he's got the first clue what to do, but at lease he's as hopeless as they are.

The one obvious certainty is that from one border to the other American drug policies are part of the problem, and may well be an actual cause. For sure they have nothing to do with any solution. We should indeed be careful we don't follow along.
Click to expand...
Good luck with that, the Chinese will be happy to have another fentanyl market.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/new...tting-through-canadas-border/article29547443/
 
A

apoptygma

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Dec 31, 2017
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oagre said:
Not sure that Portugal is a role model. My ex bro in law went there to become a heroin and opiates addict again after staying clean for several years. He was able to become an addict again with no legal risk and died of an overdose several months later - perversely back in Ontario.

OTOH, the "War on Drugs" is unwinnable and costly. Aside from creating massive organized crime and destabilizing Latin America.

I have wondered if a registration and compulsory check-up and treatment system would work far better with dependent and frequent users than the current criminal model.
Click to expand...
If someone wants to do something, they will.
Doesn't negate the fact that decriminalizing drugs in Portugal has been successful for them.
 
M

managee

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onthebottom said:
They don’t lock them up, they give them a shot of Narcan and an ambulance ride to the hospital or morgue.
Click to expand...
That would appear to not be working all that well.

It seems like better support, in-particular around medium and long-term care and treatment of both the medical and social conditions that got the junkie to an overdose might actually work to solve the issue. With certainty, making drugs ‘more illegal’ is how we got to where we are with fentanyl.

I don’t get the impression current policies in either country (US/Canada) are designed to actually break the cycle of dependency and overdose. With certainty, what we spend on punishment for simple possession could be much better spent on programming that is designed to actually rehabilitate.

But it’s complex. Obviously, if simple-possession isn’t a crime, it’s going to be much tougher to find or charge low-level dealers, which is the only way, other than luck, that you get distributors. Any move towards decriminalization is going to draw similar criticisms from our neighbours as we faced when we briefly decriminalized pot in 2006.

I’m not sure we’ll solve this without somehow regulating the entire world, or moving to punish countries that allow the manufacturing and distribution of opioids like fentanyl in the current numbers it’s being manufactured. Targeting manufacturers through tighter regulations, incentives like market access for their other products, or somehow targeting the country as a whole without violating trade agreements, seems like the way to go.
 
mandrill

mandrill

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Phil C. McNasty said:
How do you know he wasnt gonna OD eventually anyways???

I'm not trying to sound like an insensitive jerk, but the question needs to be asked.


(okay, so I'm an insensitive jerk......................I'm pretty drunk too.....LOL)
Click to expand...
Because he wasn't an addict before going to Portugal.
 
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