Major Announcement from Horwath

omegaphallic · Mar 18, 2018

Orion1027 said:
The Tories were in power for 42 uninterrupted years and again for another 8 under Harris/Eves and hydro was never sold off. Then along comes Wynne’s broke assed liberals and they sell it off in a last ditch effort to balance a single budget. How’s that for cutting off your nose to spite your face? Come to think of it everything they’ve touched turned to dog shit!!
-employer health tax
-hydro sell off
-hydro rates
-income & excise taxes
-increased fees on everything
-cap & trade
-out of control spending
-tripling the debt to 300 billion
-ehealth
-green belt
-green energy act
-ornge
-gas plants
-Caledonia
-Presto card system
-UP express
...and the list keeps going

The process of hydro privatization started off under Mike Harris, I hold both parties responsible. Hydro rates began their increase under the Tories, although the Liberals made things worse.

The Greenbelt started off as a Tory idea I believe under Ernie Eves, and back then the Tories plan for it was more expansive then the final Liberal version. I support the green belt anyways.

I'll give you most of the rest with the caveat that the Tories had their own scandals and the province was constantly in chaos under Mike Harris. I still hate the man more then any none Liberal Party politician in Canada.

Bill Davis, now he was okay.

JohnLarue · Mar 18, 2018

omegaphallic said:
Your confusing the Centre for Policy Alternatives with the bought and payed for Fraiser Institute, which is the actual joke.

No I believe you are the one who is confused
I never mentioned the Fraiser Institute

Face it, the Centre for Policy Alternatives is a joke

JohnLarue · Mar 18, 2018

omegaphallic said:
the province was constantly in chaos under Mike Harris. I still hate the man more then any none Liberal Party politician in Canada.

Chaos is to be expected when you try and undo the bureaucratic monster the Peterson & Rea governments created
Harris, a former teacher tried to reign in the abuses by the unions & they did not co-operate

The debt mess Kathleen Wynne has created is far worse & there will be chaos when it is addressed
The public service unions will fight tooth and nail as their interests are not aligned with the best interest of the province
That in and of its self is enough to question who is actually calling the shots & the question the credibility of the left

Expect more chaos. It always follows years of financial irresponsibility

Frankfooter · Mar 18, 2018

JohnLarue said:
No I believe you are the one who is confused
I never mentioned the Fraiser Institute

Face it, the Centre for Policy Alternatives is a joke

The only joke on this thread are your posts, where you've been shown to be wrong repeatedly.
Note that every claim I've made here is backed up by quotes and legit reports.
Claiming partisan bias on a report that just reported stats is typical of your claims, as if your personal views and world view is more important then facts.

You were wrong about corporate taxes leading to job growth.
Wrong about the Ford's not raising taxes.
And wrong about claims about what I said in another thread.

Face it, your posts have nothing behind them other then blowhard opinions.

nottyboi · Mar 18, 2018

Orion1027 said:
Great!! Another politician making promises with our money. Sorry, that’s incorrect it’s not our money because our money was spent. This is all borrowed money that my kids will be paying back. I find it unbelievable that people still fall for these massive loads of horse shit. Wynne with her “fairness” and free everything for everybody, Charles Sousa and his “deliberate decision to go into debt” and now Horwath with her promise to sink us deeper in debt and deeper in taxation. When is enough, enough?
I’m sick of paying 53% of what I make in direct taxes, not to mention all the passive taxation in the form of fees, service charges, excise taxes, health taxes, the bullshit carbon tax HST....am I forgetting any?

Yes the wealthy place you live that depends on equity and a large middle class so you can continue to make a high income.

JohnLarue · Mar 18, 2018

Frankfooter said:
The only joke on this thread are your posts, where you've been shown to be wrong repeatedly.
Note that every claim I've made here is backed up by quotes and legit reports.

you mean like this one "Ont is doing OK ?

Claiming partisan bias on a report that just reported stats is typical of your claims, as if your personal views and world view is more important then facts.

Says the loonie left propaganda machine
Have you eaten any rich lately ?

You were wrong about corporate taxes leading to job growth.

Nope, increased taxes are a job killer

Wrong about the Ford's not raising taxes.

The project has not gone ahead so , no new taxes

And wrong about claims about what I said in another thread.

Be more specific , You have been corrected in so many threads

Face it, your posts have nothing behind them other then blowhard opinions.

Nope the facts of the matter here are
Deficits for nine years
$300 B in debt , $12 B goes to service the interest costs & rates are rising which will add Billions onto the service cost while health care utilization is going to increase dramatically

Your blowhard opinion was
"Ont is doing OK"

the reality of those facts are the next government has to decrease spending and star chipping away at that monstrous debt

The liberals ? They created this mess & will not fix it
The NDP ? - They propose bigger government & higher taxes - the debt will balloon

That leaves only one choice if you give a rats ass about your kids or grand kids future

All very factual

JohnLarue · Mar 18, 2018

nottyboi said:
Yes the wealthy place you live that depends on equity and a large middle class so you can continue to make a high income.

That response is despicable. You are trying to shame someone who likely contributes way more to the province than you ever will.

he is taxed @ 53% & has every right to be concerned about how more than half his income is being spent.
He also has every right to be alarmed when the NDP says they will increase taxes

Frankfooter · Mar 18, 2018

JohnLarue said:
Nope, increased taxes are a job killer

False, as show previously by this study.
https://www.policyalternatives.ca/newsroom/updates/corporate-tax-cuts-not-delivering-job-creation
Corporate tax cuts do not lead to job growth.
Stop claiming that maybe this time Reagonomics will work, its stupid.

The project has not gone ahead so , no new taxes

Wrong, the taxes are passed.
http://www.metronews.ca/views/toron...-plan-for-funding-the-scarborough-subway.html
The Fords gave us a 30 year tax increase for a subway that may not get built.

Your 'facts' are still wrong.

Orion1027 · Mar 19, 2018

Your answer is both glib and disingenuous. This is no longer taxation, it’s confiscation! We are approaching the tipping point where professionals start looking to greener pastures south of the boarder or overseas. I and many others could easily incorporate myself in Ireland, the Isle of Man or the US pay little to no tax here other than consumption taxes, but that is would be unethical so I choose not to. Come down out of your ivory tower and wake up to the reality that Wynne and other so called progressives have charted. It’s a map with no direction other than petty partisan policy aimed at keeping them in power by wooing the uninformed!!!

FAST · Mar 19, 2018

How to create dept for generations,... 101

Anybody who remembers the old Ontario Hydro, and didn't think that money pit, full of unemployable non performing losers, didn't need something to be done,... ???

Needs their collective heads examined.

Frankfooter · Mar 19, 2018

Orion1027 said:
Your answer is both glib and disingenuous. This is no longer taxation, it’s confiscation! We are approaching the tipping point where professionals start looking to greener pastures south of the boarder or overseas. I and many others could easily incorporate myself in Ireland, the Isle of Man or the US pay little to no tax here other than consumption taxes, but that is would be unethical so I choose not to. Come down out of your ivory tower and wake up to the reality that Wynne and other so called progressives have charted. It’s a map with no direction other than petty partisan policy aimed at keeping them in power by wooing the uninformed!!!

Have a nice trip.

By the way, oldjones posted a great graphic that shows that Wynne has actually done well to get the budget balanced after the 2008 meltdown.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/res...azonaws.com/public/FPDR2F3KDVEQVI2PJVDZGDLVGU

omegaphallic · Mar 19, 2018

http://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.4582022

JohnLarue · Mar 19, 2018

Frankfooter said:
False, as show previously by this study.
https://www.policyalternatives.ca/newsroom/updates/corporate-tax-cuts-not-delivering-job-creation
Corporate tax cuts do not lead to job growth.
Stop claiming that maybe this time Reagonomics will work, its stupid.

Click to expand...

And the punch line is "The Center for Policy Alternative" as the crowd bursts into laughter

JohnLarue · Mar 19, 2018

Frankfooter said:
Have a nice trip.

By the way, oldjones posted a great graphic that shows that Wynne has actually done well to get the budget balanced after the 2008 meltdown.
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/res...azonaws.com/public/FPDR2F3KDVEQVI2PJVDZGDLVGU

It is not balanced, not by a long shot
She slid the hydro rebate into through the new government-owned OPG Trust.
A little slight of hand in order to try and deceive the public into believing she came close to balance. That slight of hand will cost an extra $4 B in interest payments.

She placed her political ambitions above the financial well being of the province & the taxpayers
Another $ 4 B of taxpayers money wasted by Kathleen Wynne
Borderline criminal

https://www.thestar.com/news/queens...atchdog-sounds-alarm-over-hydro-rate-cut.html

Auditor general Bonnie Lysyk estimates the scheme, unveiled last May, could cost Ontarians an additional $4 billion in interest charges over the next 30 years.
In Lysyk’s latest salvo against the provincial government in her ongoing accounting dispute with Queen’s Park, she expressed outrage at how the hydro rebate will appear on the books.
“The accounting proposed by the government is wrong,” said the auditor general, decrying the use of U.S. accounting standards that enable the Liberals to bankroll the rate cut through the new government-owned OPG Trust.
Because the trust will have to borrow money at a higher interest rate than the province pays, Lysyk estimated there will be an extra $4 billion in charges over 30 years for a total of $39.4 billion.

JohnLarue · Mar 19, 2018

Frankfooter said:
False, as show previously by this study.
https://www.policyalternatives.ca/ne...g-job-creation
Corporate tax cuts do not lead to job growth.
Stop claiming that maybe this time Reagonomics will work, its stupid.

Look dummy, higher taxes means less cash flow for companies, less cash flow means less hiring, smaller raises, less growth and re-evaluation of location by our best and brightest entrepreneurs

You can trot out all the biased left wing studies you want, they will not change the common sense fact that higher corporate taxes are not good for the economy.

All you need to do is read the business news

Canadian drillers moving rigs south to chase brighter prospects in U.S. oilfields
http://business.financialpost.com/c...-to-chase-better-prospects-in-texas-oilfields

Oil and gas investors are avoiding Alberta, all because of government policies
http://business.financialpost.com/o...ng-alberta-all-because-of-government-policies
The province continues to languish near the bottom of investment attractiveness

The investment money (& the jobs) gravitates to the highest after-tax return

lower corp taxes in the US, no carbon taxes in the US, lower payroll taxes ...... The NDP have explicitly stated they will increase corp taxes.
Do you think the auto sector companies will not notice or care when they allocate investment?
Especially when Trump is pushing hard for a bigger slice of that pie

Higher corp taxes in Ontario would be suicidal

But you wrap your self in a union funded paper which says it just is not so......... according to their make believe study

And the punch line is "The Center for Policy Alternative" as the crowd bursts into laughter

Ref · Mar 19, 2018

Frankfooter said:
Wrong, the taxes are passed.
http://www.metronews.ca/views/toron...-plan-for-funding-the-scarborough-subway.html
The Fords gave us a 30 year tax increase for a subway that may not get built.

Your 'facts' are still wrong.

If that is the case, then are those taxes sitting in a trust fund of sorts until they can be spent on the transit project? Or, have those taxes been spent on other initiatives/projects? Or, has Tory rolled back the tax increase or frozen tax increases to off-set this tax? Or, has Tory used those taxes to start building Smart Track?

Ford left office a rew years back, if this was/is such a hardship why has it not been managed by Tory?

Frankfooter · Mar 19, 2018

JohnLarue said:
Look dummy, higher taxes means less cash flow for companies, less cash flow means less hiring, smaller raises, less growth and re-evaluation of location by our best and brightest entrepreneurs

You can trot out all the biased left wing studies you want, they will not change the common sense fact that higher corporate taxes are not good for the economy.

All you need to do is read the business news

You're still pushing Reagonomics, a failed and very dated program.
Reading the business news and hearing CEO's say they'd like lower taxes is like asking Doug Ford if he'd like a bigger SUV.

Its their preference, its not an argument for a policy.
History, and all the stats, shows that lower corporate taxes do not lead to more jobs.

You really only have one idea, and its a very tired and failed idea.

Here, why not compare the results in the states, compare Oklahoma and Minnesota.
Oklahoma implement your tax cuts and policies and it totally fucked the state and got the republicans voted out.
https://theintercept.com/2017/11/30/oklahoma-special-election-budget-cuts/
Whereas Minnesota is the economic miracle of the states.

So far, the test in Kansas of conservative economic principles has largely been a failure. As we read in the Tribune's Perspective section Tuesday, large tax cuts and other austerity measures in recent years intended to spur growth have instead resulted in swollen deficits, credit downgrades and public schools having to close early because they're out of money.

In contrast, the test in Minnesota of liberal economic principles has largely been a success. As we will read today, tax and spending increases in recent years have resulted in a budget surplus and a robust economic climate that's the envy of the state's Midwestern neighbors.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...k-liberal-perspe-0506-jm-20150505-column.html

Your policies have never worked, easiest way to prove it is by asking you to show a country that's implemented them and is a success.
You can't, can you?

Frankfooter · Mar 19, 2018

Ref said:
If that is the case, then are those taxes sitting in a trust fund of sorts until they can be spent on the transit project? Or, have those taxes been spent on other initiatives/projects? Or, has Tory rolled back the tax increase or frozen tax increases to off-set this tax? Or, has Tory used those taxes to start building Smart Track?

Ford left office a rew years back, if this was/is such a hardship why has it not been managed by Tory?

'Cuz Tory is afraid of the 'burbs.
He won't can the $3 billion Ford station and he won't release the numbers to tell us how much it'll cost.
Tory's plan is unfunded, as far as I know.

Those tax increases are still in place because in theory the Ford boondoggle is still happening.
In theory.

JohnLarue · Mar 19, 2018

Frankfooter said:
You're still pushing Reagonomics, a failed and very dated program.
Reading the business news and hearing CEO's say they'd like lower taxes is like asking Doug Ford if he'd like a bigger SUV.

Says the union mouthpiece who just does not understand economics

Its their preference, its not an argument for a policy.
History, and all the stats, shows that lower corporate taxes do not lead to more jobs.

Look stupid I just showed you how investment is flying out of the oil patch and 50% of the drilling rigs have moved south
why/
Lower corp taxes, lower payroll taxes no carbon tax

Your stats and studies are a joke

What is really ironic (and sad) is the union backed NDP would increase corp taxes, practically daring the auto industry to move south to the US, meanwhile that is exactly what Trump wants.
who gets the first pink slips?..... the union guys

JohnLarue · Mar 19, 2018

Frankfooter said:
'Cuz Tory is afraid of the 'burbs.
He won't can the $3 billion Ford station and he won't release the numbers to tell us how much it'll cost.
Tory's plan is unfunded, as far as I know.

Those tax increases are still in place because in theory the Ford boondoggle is still happening.
In theory.

In theory?
I do not place a lot of stock in the theory of someone who claims "Ont is doing OK" & who wants to "Eat the rich"

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