Should México pay for Trump’s wall?

Suprapal said:

Thais would show respect to Trump and the nation he represents.

It's called leadership.

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Why would you show any respect to a bigoted buffoon who has insulted your country ???? Why would you validate an idiotic campaign promise made to gullible voters which Trump himself suggested in a recorded conversation to the Mexican president was just a political ploy ? Trump isn't the USA. In a few years he will go and you don't want to hang debt that outlasts his tenure as a demonic leader.

I would also remind you that there was a huge protest in Mexico when Trump visited Mexico during the campaign even though the Mexican president said he just wanted to tell Trump to his face that Mexico isn't going to pay for the wall.

It was a ludicrous promise Trump made - and like so many other broken promises - let Trump deal with it.

Why bother, Trump won't likely last that long.

IM469 said:

Why would you show any respect to a bigoted buffoon who has insulted your country ?

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Because it is in your economic and national best interest to do so.

Now that is a different question from at the present time is this politically possible in Mexico.

Suprapal said:

Here is a parallel: The USA is Australia's most important partner. Daylight is second.
In the recent past, Australia had to pretend Bush 43's Iraq war was actually a worthwhile adventure. Everyone knew it was bullshit, even while it was happening. But the country still sent soldiers, went to war and pretended to earnestly look for those WMD's. Because that's what made the 43rd POTUS happy.

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To say Australia committed troops to Iraq purely out of appeasement grossly misrepresents what was happening under the Howard government at the time.

This was less than a year after the Bali attack which killed 80 something Australians. Iraq, to the Howard government, was seen as part of the larger war on terror (‘access of evil’ argument).

Like Blair, Howard and his cronies drank the WMD + support for Team USA argument Kool-Aid while significant opposition to troop commitment was echoing within his own government. Suggesting that ‘supporting the US’ was THE motivating factor for troop commitment is an incredibly biased and uninformed opinion.

They got bad intelligence, there was a Parliamentary then Public Inquiry that proved it.

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Mexicans aren’t stupid. The wall may be a physical barrier to his Trumpness, but it’s a metaphorical one to Mexicans. They know how stupid this idea is, and Trump is only now starting to catch on. This will very likely not hinder cross-border illegal activity in the least, and it’s much more of a statement about “us” not wanting “you” in our country.

When you throw out trade numbers, sure some of those $$$ come back in the form of taxes, but most of that goes straight into the pockets of large Mexican corporations. The people of Mexico don’t benefit in any real way from this kind of expenditure, an amount that surely can do better on socially responsible budget items.

If Trump, or anyone else actually wanted to stop the flow of migrants, he’d be looking to solve the drugs problem in America.

Without drug cartels, you don’t have the violence and/or inflation and hyperinflation in producer and transit countries that is fueling the migrant-crisis. Drug cartels will disappear tomorrow if there is no more demand for their product.

No wall will prevent a determined individual from getting to America. Geographically, the border and its vicinity is too difficult to monitor and guard effectively, and even if going over it or under it isn’t an option, going around it is.

Mexico’s got better shit to do with its money than spend it on Trump’s next election campaign.

As long as Trump and whoever comes next continues to enable its citizens’ drug habits, this migration crisis won’t end. So if a wall won’t stop the crisis, why fund idiocy?

Sometimes you have to do things to succeed, whether you want to do them or not. Of course Mexico doesn't want to pay for the wall, or pay the costs to US taxpayers of patrolling the border, or the costs to enforce immigration laws against illegal aliens from Mexico, or additional policing costs. But that's beside the point. The question is, what are they prepared to do about these costs, now that there is a President who is prioritizing these problems?

Mexico has a number of more pressing problems to address. Why would they waste their precious resources on such stupid projects that does not benefit them or their economy in any way.

Bud Plug said:

The question is, what are they prepared to do about these costs, now that there is a President who is prioritizing these problems?

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How about sweet fuck all?
They are a sovereign nation.

The Mexican "leaders" are too dumb to realize that their asses are on the chopping block and that to make a grand gesture (any gesture) would be in their best interest. They don't give a fuck all about the Mexican people, anyway. They never did.

apoptygma said:

How about sweet fuck all?
They are a sovereign nation.

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Yes, they are a sovereign nation leeching their problems onto their neighbor, who happens to have a lot of leverage over them. And that neighbor happens to be saying it's time to do something about it. A smart sovereign nation makes a deal in those circumstances, rather than dares the neighbor to use his leverage.

jcpro said:

The Mexican "leaders" are too dumb to realize that their asses are on the chopping block and that to make a grand gesture (any gesture) would be in their best interest. They don't give a fuck all about the Mexican people, anyway. They never did.

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All true... except you are aiming a little too south on the map.

Bud Plug said:

Yes, they are a sovereign nation leeching their problems onto their neighbor, who happens to have a lot of leverage over them. And that neighbor happens to be saying it's time to do something about it. A smart sovereign nation makes a deal in those circumstances, rather than dares the neighbor to use his leverage.

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The problem is, is that Nieto has more than two brain cells to rub together, so is significantly smarter than his northern compatriot.

That 'neighbour' has been belching about a wall for over two years... over one full year where he actually has been in a position to do something about it... but nothing, except for a few science project prototypes... forget talking about the budget and logistics of such a yuge project.

Nieto, like other rational individuals, knows that Trump is full of shit.

Bud Plug said:

Sometimes you have to do things to succeed, whether you want to do them or not. Of course Mexico doesn't want to pay for the wall, or pay the costs to US taxpayers of patrolling the border, or the costs to enforce immigration laws against illegal aliens from Mexico, or additional policing costs. But that's beside the point. The question is, what are they prepared to do about these costs, now that there is a President who is prioritizing these problems?

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Time will tell.

What he’s saying on the phone to Nieto, who knows? Free aid for wall money? If it’s just his “Imma get my money. Bitch never heard’a NAFTA?” argument, he’ll be slapped with legally applied reciprocal tariffs. I wonder which senators Mexico will target?

I don’t see Neito getting another term based on his popularity, and the idea of paying for the wall is strongly opposed by all political parties that I’m aware of. So, it’s almost defintiely going to be an election promise. I literally haven’t met a Mexican who supports having their government pay for it, so I’m not sure how Trump will get it without some serious self-harm through tariffs.

But nothing’s more important than a message, I guess.

The US was helping pay for Mexico's Southern border enforcement.

'Programa Frontera Sur:' US Intercedes in Southern Mexico
https://www.azpm.org/s/39635-programa-frontera-sur-interceding-in-southern-mexico/

US funds Mexican government's efforts to slow Central American illegal immigration.

Southern exposure: The costly border plan Mexico won't discuss
https://www.theglobeandmail.com/new...exico-wont-discuss-migration/article30397720/

Suprapal said:

This would show respect to Trump and the nation he represents.

It's called leadership.

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An Mexican leader who followed that path would soon be an ex-leader
A much better plan is to wait for Trump to implode or be voted out in three years time.

Then pass a law stating Donald Trump is not permitted to enter mexico EVER on fears what ever in the world is wrong with him just might be contagious

If I were advising the POTUS I’d suggest he offer to pay for the wall if Mexico is supportive of US illegal immigration policy mirroring that of Mexico.... if not they should pony up.

Why would Mexico make an idiotic payment in order to construct an idiotic wall which was simply political red meat for Trumps base and no serious person thinks will have any real benefit. Perhaps the most bigly harm that the PGOTUS is doing is that he is forcing otherwise smart and thoughtful people to be very dumb in order to support the most unqualified president in history. Are SCOTUS appointments and tax cuts worth it. I think not. SAD.