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Right-Wing Talking Heads Are Smearing the Parkland Survivors

Charlemagne

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Jul 19, 2017
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The Republicans' Plan to Stop Mass Shootings: Nothing

Right-Wing Talking Heads Are Smearing the Parkland Survivors

Some are claiming the kids are leftist pawns or even "crisis actors" who faked the whole thing.

Eve Peyser

Feb 21 2018, 5:50pm

On Valentine's Day, a gunman opened fire at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Florida, killing 17 of his former classmates and teachers. In the week following the shooting, Parkland students have demanded legislation that could prevent future tragedies, becoming spokespeople for the gun control movement overnight.

"If all our president and government can do is send 'thoughts and prayers,' then it's time for victims to be the change we need to see," said Emma Gonzalez, a Stoneman student, in a teary speech last week. "They say that tougher gun laws do not decrease gun violence—we call BS!"

Obviously, the majority of right-wing politicians and media personalities are not going to be convinced that assault weapons need to be banned by either the shooting or its aftermath. But surely they would be respectful to teenagers who had just watched their classmates get murdered, right? Nope! While some GOP figures like Florida Senator Marco Rubio have been relatively restrained, some right-wing media websites and personalities and tried to discredit the Parkland shooting victims as "false flags" and "crisis actors," taking a note from the Alex Jones's playbook—the unhinged InfoWars host famous for being a Sandy Hook truther, among other things.

On Wednesday, a video claiming David Hogg, a Stoneman senior, was an actor "bought and paid by CNN and George Soros" was the number-one trending video on YouTube until the video platform took it down after the media noticed. On Tuesday, the president's eldest son, Donald Jr., was caught liking two tweets that pushed the same BS conspiracy theory about Hogg.

“I’m not a crisis actor,” Hogg told Anderson Cooper on CNN. “I’m someone who had to witness this and live through this and I continue to be having to do that.”

Here are the right wingers who have attacked its student survivors:

The Gateway Pundit

On Tuesday, Lucian Wintrich, the "D.C. Bureau Chief & White House Correspondent" for the Gateway Pundit, a particularly toxic conservative blog known for propagating hoaxes and its exceptional disregard for what's actually true, penned a post headlined "EXPOSED: School Shooting Survivor Turned Activist David Hogg’s Father in FBI, Appears To Have Been Coached On Anti-Trump Lines." Wintrich accused Hogg being "heavily coached on lines" and "merely reciting a script," using the fact that his father works for the FBI as evidence that he's part of a larger mainstream media conspiracy to push the "anti-Conservative/anti-Trump narrative."

Later on Tuesday, Wintrich published another post, this one headlined, "Exclusive: Soros-Linked Organizers of 'Women’s March' Selected Anti-Trump Kids to Be Face of Parkland Tragedy – And Excluded Pro-Trump Kids," which cites an anonymous source the Gateway Pundit claims is the father of a shooting victim, and goes on to find sinister implications in the fact that these students are drama kids.

"These children are being used as political tools by the far left to further anti-Conservative rhetoric and an anti-gun agenda," Wintrich wrote. "The students at the forefront of this agenda were all peers of his child, they were all members of the same drama club at their high school. This fact was verified and confirmed by Buzzfeed who sent a reporter to visit the student activists at their “command center” at one of their homes. Buzzfeed reported on, but left unexplored, the fact that these students are theater-trained."

InfoWars

Not to be outdone by the Gateway Pundit, Alex Jones's InfoWars has pushed a number of false theories about the Parkland shooting. As reported by the New York Times, Jones "suggested that the mass shooting was a 'false flag' orchestrated by anti-gun groups."

An article with the headline, "STUDENT ANTI-GUN ACTIVIST FEATURED IN CBS NEWS STORY – SIX MONTHS AGO" that was written by Dan Lyman, the "InfoWars/NewsWars foreign correspondent," tries to discredit Hogg's newfound role as an anti-gun activist by pointing out that he appeared in a local CBS news report six months ago. It also mentions the same video the Gateway Pundit video used, which Lyman claims "appears to show Hogg being walked through rehearsed lines in an interview after the shooting."

InfoWars has published many conspiratorial articles about the shooting in the last week—accusing liberals of "exploit[ing] the tragic event, as they often do, by voicing their disdain for the Second Amendment," blaming antidepressants for the tragedy, and arguing that there was a secret second shooter in the attack.

Rush Limbaugh

The conservative radio host, whose program draws about 13 million listeners per week, went after Parkland survivors in his broadcast, asserting: “Everything they’re doing is right out of the Democrat Party’s various playbooks. It has the same enemies: the NRA and guns.”

Fox News

The conservative cable news network hasn't gone after students like Gonzalez and Hogg as vigorously as its more conspiratorial counterparts have. An op-ed published Tuesday on FoxNews.com, however, asserted, "The mainstream media is cynically using a lot of traumatized teens from Parkland, Fla., in their latest shameful attack on President Trump and the National Rifle Association."

"It's right out of the pages of 'Rules for Radicals,'" complained author Todd Starnes in a passage that sounds like a right-wing version of Mad Libs. "Turning innocent children into propaganda pawns to peddle a fake news narrative."

Dinesh D'Souza

The right-wing activist, convicted felon, and National Review contributor, whose latest book accuses the American left of having roots in Nazism, had some astonishingly unkind words for the Parkland survivors.

"Worst news since their parents told them to get summer jobs," D'Souza commented on a photo of Parkland survivors crying after Florida lawmakers declined to vote on a bill banning assault rifles.

"Adults 1, kids 0," he also wrote in response to the same news.

Ted Nugent

On his Facebook page, which has almost 3.5 million likes, the right-wing activist and music dude posted a link to an article from Natural News—which purports to be "the world's top news source on natural health"—headlined, "It’s all THEATER: Florida high school shooting survivor caught on video rehearsing scripted lines, coached by camera man," which is an aggregation of Wintrich's Gateway Pundit story.

Bill O'Reilly

The former Fox News host, who was fired after multiple allegations of sexual harassment and once paid $32 million to settle a sexual harassment lawsuit, didn't go as far as D'Souza or the Gateway Pundit, but echoed the idea that the surviving students are leftist pawns on Twitter and "debated" the topic on his personal website.

David Clarke

The former Milwaukee sheriff, who was once investigated by the FBI for sending his officers after a guy who got into an argument with him on a plane and on whose watch a mentally ill jail inmate died of dehydration, is another right-wing talking head being an asshole to the teenage mass shooting survivors. According to Media Matters, Clarke was on something called the Joe Pags Show on Monday, which began with host Joe Pagliarulo opining that Gonzalez “a far-lefty propagandist—well, I don’t know that she’s a propagandist... Maybe her parents are, maybe the community is." Later in the program, Clarke said, “My dad would have backhanded me” for “popping off” against an authority figure like President Trump.

It's worth noting that Clarke spent years popping off against Barack Obama, but it's not like calling him—or any of people on this list—out for hypocrisy is particularly useful.

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/bj5yqw/rush-limbaugh-ted-nugent-parkland


The #1 Trending Video on YouTube Right Now Suggests That a Student From the Parkland Shooting Is a Crisis Actor

A video described as 'DAVID HOGG THE ACTOR….' has made the top of the trending section, another example that YouTube has a conspiracy theory problem.

Emanuel Maiberg

Feb 21 2018, 8:32am

Update: YouTube has removed the video about three hours after this article was first published. It had more than 200,000 views at the time. Other videos from the same YouTube user spreading the same conspiracy theory are still live on YouTube.

A YouTube spokesperson sent us the following statement:

"This video should never have appeared in Trending. Because the video contained footage from an authoritative news source, our system misclassified it. As soon as we became aware of the video, we removed it from Trending and from YouTube for violating our policies. We are working to improve our systems moving forward."

It's a vile conspiracy theory we might expect from the host of Inforwars Alex Jones, but right now it is the number one trending video on YouTube.

The conspiracy theory is that some of the students who are speaking out against the lax gun control laws that enabled the mass shooting that killed 17 of their peers at a Parkland, Florida high school last week are not who they say they are. They are "crisis actors," paid performers funded by familiar boogeymen like George Soros to vilify gun ownership and dismantle the Second Amendment.

This is not true, but it's what the most popular video on YouTube, which at the time of writing has 174,000 views, suggests. In the video, David Hogg, one of the more outspoken Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School students who has made several television appearances since the shooting, is seen in a CBS 2 Los Angeles news report. The report details the events of a video Hogg took and that went viral in 2017. It shows one of Hogg's friends, another teenager, confronting an overzealous lifeguard. Here's the video on CBS's YouTube page, and Hogg's original upload.

The only description on the video is "DAVID HOGG THE ACTOR…." and many of the comments go on to accuse Hogg of being an actor "bought and paid by CNN and George Soros." Mike m, the YouTube user who uploaded this trending video also uploaded a video titled "David Hogg Can't Remember His Lines When Interviewed for Florida school shooting." The description to that video reads: "Ask yourself why is he practicing his lines...??? ???" This user also uploaded videos that cover familiar conspiracy theories like chemtrails and UFOs.

As Hogg explained to CNN, his family moved from California to Florida several years ago and he joined Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School for its TV production program. He took the video of the lifeguard while visiting friends in Los Angeles.

It’s a coincidence that some random person in a local news report will go viral on YouTube and then make national news for vastly different reasons, but it happens. I'm still trying to wrap my brain around the fact that George Lindell, the subject of the autotuned viral video "Reality Hits You Hard Bro" also went viral in 2016 for yelling "Jew-S-A" at a press pen at a Trump rally, but it's true. Life is weird and full of coincidences. Things that seem very unlikely, like, say, landing on the moon, actually happen. It's true.

It's not surprising but still shameful that this trending video is one of many on YouTube. If you watch it, YouTube is likely to offer you videos that claim to show Hogg "forgetting his lines" while speaking to CNN, "SICK secrets about the shooting," and other lies right-wing media uses to muddy the waters around the issue of gun control.

It's only been a month since YouTube was in hot water over its trending videos, which previously highlighted a Logan Paul video that featured a man who took his own life in the thumbnail. As Wired noted at the time, that should have been a moment of reckoning for YouTube, but the trending Hogg video shows that it learned nothing.

Update: When this article was first published the YouTube video suggesting David Hogg is a crisis actor was the number two trending video on YouTube. It is now the number one trending video on YouTube.

https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/mb5p4y/youtube-david-hogg-parkland-shooting-conspiracy-theory
 

Bud Plug

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Aug 17, 2001
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Anyone who watched the CNN Town Hall last night knows that quite a few of the teenagers who spoke had a lot of coaching. It was easy to tell based on some of the wording of their statements and some of their debating tactics, but more obviously by the structure and presentation of their questions. However, that's an unnecessary point. Reality is, adults should sympathize with these teenagers, their fears, and their wish to feel safe. But adults should not be taking advice or direction from teenagers. In short, they have little life experience, lack perspective, almost no understanding of history, don't think things through, and quite simply, aren't that bright at that point in their lives. No argument is improved because teenagers side with it.
 

apoptygma

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Dec 31, 2017
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Anyone who watched the CNN Town Hall last night knows that quite a few of the teenagers who spoke had a lot of coaching. It was easy to tell based on some of the wording of their statements and some of their debating tactics, but more obviously by the structure and presentation of their questions. However, that's an unnecessary point. Reality is, adults should sympathize with these teenagers, their fears, and their wish to feel safe. But adults should not be taking advice or direction from teenagers. In short, they have little life experience, lack perspective, almost no understanding of history, don't think things through, and quite simply, aren't that bright at that point in their lives. No argument is improved because teenagers side with it.
Trump had some coaching too:
https://www.thestar.com/news/world/analysis/2018/02/21/this-photo-of-trumps-notes-captures-his-empathy-deficit-better-than-anything.html
 

oldjones

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Aug 18, 2001
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Anyone who watched the CNN Town Hall last night knows that quite a few of the teenagers who spoke had a lot of coaching. It was easy to tell based on some of the wording of their statements and some of their debating tactics, but more obviously by the structure and presentation of their questions. However, that's an unnecessary point. Reality is, adults should sympathize with these teenagers, their fears, and their wish to feel safe. But adults should not be taking advice or direction from teenagers. In short, they have little life experience, lack perspective, almost no understanding of history, don't think things through, and quite simply, aren't that bright at that point in their lives. No argument is improved because teenagers side with it.
All true. But we are talking about yet another mass-shooting of school-kids. No one is more involved and concerned than they are. And the more people say it's not for them to say how to fix that horrible reality of American life the more obvious is the other horrible American reality: no adult is fixing it, and many don't want anything fixed.
 

toguy5252

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Jun 22, 2009
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Anyone who watched the CNN Town Hall last night knows that quite a few of the teenagers who spoke had a lot of coaching. It was easy to tell based on some of the wording of their statements and some of their debating tactics, but more obviously by the structure and presentation of their questions. However, that's an unnecessary point. Reality is, adults should sympathize with these teenagers, their fears, and their wish to feel safe. But adults should not be taking advice or direction from teenagers. In short, they have little life experience, lack perspective, almost no understanding of history, don't think things through, and quite simply, aren't that bright at that point in their lives. No argument is improved because teenagers side with it.
That is really quite condescending to those amazing young adults. Why is it obvious to you that they had coaching. Is it not possible that these young men and women were able to articulate their own thoughts and opinions.

To me it was obvious that the students in the room were the voice of reason and it make me hopeful for the future of the US. Compare them to the blathering of the PGOTUS even with the help of his notes.
 

toguy5252

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Jun 22, 2009
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The Republicans' Plan to Stop Mass Shootings: Nothing

Right-Wing Talking Heads Are Smearing the Parkland Survivors

Some are claiming the kids are leftist pawns or even "crisis actors" who faked the whole thing.

Eve Peyser

Feb 21 2018, 5:50pm

On Valentine's Day, a gunman opened fire at Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Florida, killing 17 of his former classmates and teachers. In the week following the shooting, Parkland students have demanded legislation that could prevent future tragedies, becoming spokespeople for the gun control movement overnight.

"If all our president and government can do is send 'thoughts and prayers,' then it's time for victims to be the change we need to see," said Emma Gonzalez, a Stoneman student, in a teary speech last week. "They say that tougher gun laws do not decrease gun violence—we call BS!"

Obviously, the majority of right-wing politicians and media personalities are not going to be convinced that assault weapons need to be banned by either the shooting or its aftermath. But surely they would be respectful to teenagers who had just watched their classmates get murdered, right? Nope! While some GOP figures like Florida Senator Marco Rubio have been relatively restrained, some right-wing media websites and personalities and tried to discredit the Parkland shooting victims as "false flags" and "crisis actors," taking a note from the Alex Jones's playbook—the unhinged InfoWars host famous for being a Sandy Hook truther, among other things.

On Wednesday, a video claiming David Hogg, a Stoneman senior, was an actor "bought and paid by CNN and George Soros" was the number-one trending video on YouTube until the video platform took it down after the media noticed. On Tuesday, the president's eldest son, Donald Jr., was caught liking two tweets that pushed the same BS conspiracy theory about Hogg.

“I’m not a crisis actor,” Hogg told Anderson Cooper on CNN. “I’m someone who had to witness this and live through this and I continue to be having to do that.”

Here are the right wingers who have attacked its student survivors:

The Gateway Pundit

On Tuesday, Lucian Wintrich, the "D.C. Bureau Chief & White House Correspondent" for the Gateway Pundit, a particularly toxic conservative blog known for propagating hoaxes and its exceptional disregard for what's actually true, penned a post headlined "EXPOSED: School Shooting Survivor Turned Activist David Hogg’s Father in FBI, Appears To Have Been Coached On Anti-Trump Lines." Wintrich accused Hogg being "heavily coached on lines" and "merely reciting a script," using the fact that his father works for the FBI as evidence that he's part of a larger mainstream media conspiracy to push the "anti-Conservative/anti-Trump narrative."

Later on Tuesday, Wintrich published another post, this one headlined, "Exclusive: Soros-Linked Organizers of 'Women’s March' Selected Anti-Trump Kids to Be Face of Parkland Tragedy – And Excluded Pro-Trump Kids," which cites an anonymous source the Gateway Pundit claims is the father of a shooting victim, and goes on to find sinister implications in the fact that these students are drama kids.

"These children are being used as political tools by the far left to further anti-Conservative rhetoric and an anti-gun agenda," Wintrich wrote. "The students at the forefront of this agenda were all peers of his child, they were all members of the same drama club at their high school. This fact was verified and confirmed by Buzzfeed who sent a reporter to visit the student activists at their “command center” at one of their homes. Buzzfeed reported on, but left unexplored, the fact that these students are theater-trained."

InfoWars

Not to be outdone by the Gateway Pundit, Alex Jones's InfoWars has pushed a number of false theories about the Parkland shooting. As reported by the New York Times, Jones "suggested that the mass shooting was a 'false flag' orchestrated by anti-gun groups."

An article with the headline, "STUDENT ANTI-GUN ACTIVIST FEATURED IN CBS NEWS STORY – SIX MONTHS AGO" that was written by Dan Lyman, the "InfoWars/NewsWars foreign correspondent," tries to discredit Hogg's newfound role as an anti-gun activist by pointing out that he appeared in a local CBS news report six months ago. It also mentions the same video the Gateway Pundit video used, which Lyman claims "appears to show Hogg being walked through rehearsed lines in an interview after the shooting."

InfoWars has published many conspiratorial articles about the shooting in the last week—accusing liberals of "exploit[ing] the tragic event, as they often do, by voicing their disdain for the Second Amendment," blaming antidepressants for the tragedy, and arguing that there was a secret second shooter in the attack.

Rush Limbaugh

The conservative radio host, whose program draws about 13 million listeners per week, went after Parkland survivors in his broadcast, asserting: “Everything they’re doing is right out of the Democrat Party’s various playbooks. It has the same enemies: the NRA and guns.”

Fox News

The conservative cable news network hasn't gone after students like Gonzalez and Hogg as vigorously as its more conspiratorial counterparts have. An op-ed published Tuesday on FoxNews.com, however, asserted, "The mainstream media is cynically using a lot of traumatized teens from Parkland, Fla., in their latest shameful attack on President Trump and the National Rifle Association."

"It's right out of the pages of 'Rules for Radicals,'" complained author Todd Starnes in a passage that sounds like a right-wing version of Mad Libs. "Turning innocent children into propaganda pawns to peddle a fake news narrative."

Dinesh D'Souza

The right-wing activist, convicted felon, and National Review contributor, whose latest book accuses the American left of having roots in Nazism, had some astonishingly unkind words for the Parkland survivors.

"Worst news since their parents told them to get summer jobs," D'Souza commented on a photo of Parkland survivors crying after Florida lawmakers declined to vote on a bill banning assault rifles.

"Adults 1, kids 0," he also wrote in response to the same news.

Ted Nugent

On his Facebook page, which has almost 3.5 million likes, the right-wing activist and music dude posted a link to an article from Natural News—which purports to be "the world's top news source on natural health"—headlined, "It’s all THEATER: Florida high school shooting survivor caught on video rehearsing scripted lines, coached by camera man," which is an aggregation of Wintrich's Gateway Pundit story.

Bill O'Reilly

The former Fox News host, who was fired after multiple allegations of sexual harassment and once paid $32 million to settle a sexual harassment lawsuit, didn't go as far as D'Souza or the Gateway Pundit, but echoed the idea that the surviving students are leftist pawns on Twitter and "debated" the topic on his personal website.

David Clarke

The former Milwaukee sheriff, who was once investigated by the FBI for sending his officers after a guy who got into an argument with him on a plane and on whose watch a mentally ill jail inmate died of dehydration, is another right-wing talking head being an asshole to the teenage mass shooting survivors. According to Media Matters, Clarke was on something called the Joe Pags Show on Monday, which began with host Joe Pagliarulo opining that Gonzalez “a far-lefty propagandist—well, I don’t know that she’s a propagandist... Maybe her parents are, maybe the community is." Later in the program, Clarke said, “My dad would have backhanded me” for “popping off” against an authority figure like President Trump.

It's worth noting that Clarke spent years popping off against Barack Obama, but it's not like calling him—or any of people on this list—out for hypocrisy is particularly useful.

https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/bj5yqw/rush-limbaugh-ted-nugent-parkland


The #1 Trending Video on YouTube Right Now Suggests That a Student From the Parkland Shooting Is a Crisis Actor

A video described as 'DAVID HOGG THE ACTOR….' has made the top of the trending section, another example that YouTube has a conspiracy theory problem.

Emanuel Maiberg

Feb 21 2018, 8:32am

Update: YouTube has removed the video about three hours after this article was first published. It had more than 200,000 views at the time. Other videos from the same YouTube user spreading the same conspiracy theory are still live on YouTube.

A YouTube spokesperson sent us the following statement:

"This video should never have appeared in Trending. Because the video contained footage from an authoritative news source, our system misclassified it. As soon as we became aware of the video, we removed it from Trending and from YouTube for violating our policies. We are working to improve our systems moving forward."

It's a vile conspiracy theory we might expect from the host of Inforwars Alex Jones, but right now it is the number one trending video on YouTube.

The conspiracy theory is that some of the students who are speaking out against the lax gun control laws that enabled the mass shooting that killed 17 of their peers at a Parkland, Florida high school last week are not who they say they are. They are "crisis actors," paid performers funded by familiar boogeymen like George Soros to vilify gun ownership and dismantle the Second Amendment.

This is not true, but it's what the most popular video on YouTube, which at the time of writing has 174,000 views, suggests. In the video, David Hogg, one of the more outspoken Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School students who has made several television appearances since the shooting, is seen in a CBS 2 Los Angeles news report. The report details the events of a video Hogg took and that went viral in 2017. It shows one of Hogg's friends, another teenager, confronting an overzealous lifeguard. Here's the video on CBS's YouTube page, and Hogg's original upload.

The only description on the video is "DAVID HOGG THE ACTOR…." and many of the comments go on to accuse Hogg of being an actor "bought and paid by CNN and George Soros." Mike m, the YouTube user who uploaded this trending video also uploaded a video titled "David Hogg Can't Remember His Lines When Interviewed for Florida school shooting." The description to that video reads: "Ask yourself why is he practicing his lines...??? ???" This user also uploaded videos that cover familiar conspiracy theories like chemtrails and UFOs.

As Hogg explained to CNN, his family moved from California to Florida several years ago and he joined Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School for its TV production program. He took the video of the lifeguard while visiting friends in Los Angeles.

It’s a coincidence that some random person in a local news report will go viral on YouTube and then make national news for vastly different reasons, but it happens. I'm still trying to wrap my brain around the fact that George Lindell, the subject of the autotuned viral video "Reality Hits You Hard Bro" also went viral in 2016 for yelling "Jew-S-A" at a press pen at a Trump rally, but it's true. Life is weird and full of coincidences. Things that seem very unlikely, like, say, landing on the moon, actually happen. It's true.

It's not surprising but still shameful that this trending video is one of many on YouTube. If you watch it, YouTube is likely to offer you videos that claim to show Hogg "forgetting his lines" while speaking to CNN, "SICK secrets about the shooting," and other lies right-wing media uses to muddy the waters around the issue of gun control.

It's only been a month since YouTube was in hot water over its trending videos, which previously highlighted a Logan Paul video that featured a man who took his own life in the thumbnail. As Wired noted at the time, that should have been a moment of reckoning for YouTube, but the trending Hogg video shows that it learned nothing.

Update: When this article was first published the YouTube video suggesting David Hogg is a crisis actor was the number two trending video on YouTube. It is now the number one trending video on YouTube.

https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/mb5p4y/youtube-david-hogg-parkland-shooting-conspiracy-theory
Standard tactic. Today version of swiftboating. Despicable and rally quite pathetic. Regrettably it seems to be effective among Trump supporters and the Trumpanistas. Sad.
 

Bud Plug

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That is really quite condescending to those amazing young adults. Why is it obvious to you that they had coaching. Is it not possible that these young men and women were able to articulate their own thoughts and opinions.

To me it was obvious that the students in the room were the voice of reason and it make me hopeful for the future of the US. Compare them to the blathering of the PGOTUS even with the help of his notes.
You haven't spent much time around high school students, have you? Teenagers neither compose their questions, nor engage in the tactics you saw from several of them on that stage last night. Someone helped several of them write the questions, and suggested how they should address/attack Rubio and/or the NRA spokesperson.

Btw, I don't have a problem with the idea of condescending to teenagers with a fraction of my experience and education. That's why these kids have teachers at their school. They still have a lot to learn. There is a real difference between respecting potential and honestly evaluating current ability.
 

Bud Plug

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All true. But we are talking about yet another mass-shooting of school-kids. No one is more involved and concerned than they are. And the more people say it's not for them to say how to fix that horrible reality of American life the more obvious is the other horrible American reality: no adult is fixing it, and many don't want anything fixed.
I thought Rubio did an excellent job, supported by Nelson, of explaining the conflicting values and political jostling that accounts for failing to solve a problem that everyone wants to solve (I don't accept your contention that any significant number of people want school shootings to continue). I think it was useful for those students who were open to learning to have heard the explanation. It was probably the first time it had ever been articulated to them.

American politics have been roughly split 50/50 between the GOP and Dems for quite some time now. Rubio is right when he says the only way FORWARD is to implement what can be agreed upon, and hope that more can be agreed upon over time. The only other way forward would be for one party to be given super majority control over the the House, the Senate and the WH. That appears to be unlikely to happen anytime soon. Those who believe otherwise can continue the blockade, I suppose.
 

bver_hunter

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Nov 5, 2005
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You haven't spent much time around high school students, have you? Teenagers neither compose their questions, nor engage in the tactics you saw from several of them on that stage last night. Someone helped several of them write the questions, and suggested how they should address/attack Rubio and/or the NRA spokesperson.

Btw, I don't have a problem with the idea of condescending to teenagers with a fraction of my experience and education. That's why these kids have teachers at their school. They still have a lot to learn. There is a real difference between respecting potential and honestly evaluating current ability.
Rubio reflected these students views in everything they passionately requested except continuing to be funded by the NRA as well as the banning of the semi automatic weapons.
These students were smart, and Rubio agreed with them. Obviously, Rubio will not go as far as accepting all that the students stood for. But, raising the minimum age to 21, more secure background checks, banning bump stocks and not arming teachers with guns, was something he was on board with the students. You have to give him credit where credit is due. By contrast look at how the NRA has not budged, with respect to the speech by the CEO of the NRA at the CPAC today. He has lashed away at the likes of Rubio and the rest of the Republicans who have changed their views with respect to the gun laws. That is why I give credit to the wonderful job that these students have so passionately accomplished. Thanks to CNN for offering them a platform while Fox News as usual was highly critical of their stance in these respect.
 

Charlemagne

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Jul 19, 2017
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You haven't spent much time around high school students, have you? Teenagers neither compose their questions, nor engage in the tactics you saw from several of them on that stage last night. Someone helped several of them write the questions, and suggested how they should address/attack Rubio and/or the NRA spokesperson.

Btw, I don't have a problem with the idea of condescending to teenagers with a fraction of my experience and education. That's why these kids have teachers at their school. They still have a lot to learn. There is a real difference between respecting potential and honestly evaluating current ability.
Did you graduate from highschool?
 

Bud Plug

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Did you graduate from highschool?
I can see why you mostly just dump articles written by others. Good decision.

When it comes to evaluating your own educational/cognitive development, I think this latest post and Res Ipsa Loquitur pretty well cover it.
 

guelph

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You haven't spent much time around high school students, have you? Teenagers neither compose their questions, nor engage in the tactics you saw from several of them on that stage last night. Someone helped several of them write the questions, and suggested how they should address/attack Rubio and/or the NRA spokesperson.
Unless they are in debating club
 

Bud Plug

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Nonsense... the Omniscient Bud has spoken.
SILENCE!
Now the "you think you're a know-it-all" argument is one that I would concede is typical of the high school level. Thanks for the example, but get back to your homework son!

However, none of the outliers at the Town Hall went to that one.
 

b4u

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Jul 23, 2010
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Fla. shooting survivor says CNN rejected town hall armed guards question: 'It ended up being all scripted'

A student survivor of last week's mass shooting at a Parkland, Fla., high school said he was asked by CNN to "write a speech and ask questions" for a town hall but declined to attend the event after "it ended up being all scripted," a claim the network is pushing back on.

"CNN had originally asked me to write a speech and questions and it ended up being all scripted," Colton Haab told WPLG-TV, an ABC affiliate in Miami.

"I expected to be able to ask my questions and give my opinion on my questions," said Haab.

"I don't think that it's going get anything accomplished," he concluded. "It's not gonna ask the true questions that all the parents and teachers and students have."
The WPLG-TV report said that Haab wanted to ask a question about using veterans as armed security guards as a deterrent to school shootings.

CNN aired the live town hall, "Stand Up: The Students of Stoneman Douglas Demand Action," from the BB&T Center in Sunrise, Fla., on Wednesday night. The discussion included Sen. Marco Rubio (R-Fla.), Sen. Bill Nelson (D-Fla.), Rep. Ted Deutch (D-Fla.) and NRA spokesperson Dana Loesch.

"There is absolutely no truth to this," said Richard Hudock, CNN's senior manager of public relations in a statement provided to The Hill. "CNN did not provide or script questions for anyone in last night's town hall, nor have we ever.

"After seeing an interview with Colton Haab, we invited him to participate in our town hall along with other students and administrators from Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School," Hudock said. "Colton’s father withdrew his name from participation before the forum began, which we regretted but respected.

"We welcome Colton to join us on CNN today to discuss his views on school safety," he said.

Haab is a member of the junior Reserve Officers' Training Corps (JROTC) and shielded other Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School students while the shooter went on his rampage, according to a CNN report after the massacre last week.

Haab reportedly "ushered 60 to 70 people to shelter in an open Junior Reserve Officers' Training Corps room" and used "Kevlar sheets generally used for the Junior ROTC marksmanship program" to hide and shield those in the room the shooter and possible gunfire.

"We took those sheets, and we put them in front of everybody so they weren't seen, because they were behind a solid object and the Kevlar would slow the bullet down," Haab told CNN at the time.

"I didn't think it was going to stop it, but it would definitely slow it down to make it from a catastrophic to a lifesaving thing," he added.

Haab said he also believed that assistant football coach Aaron Feis, who was killed in the shooting while shielding students from the shooter, could have "stopped the threat" if he was armed.

"If coach Feis had had his firearm in school that day, I believe that he could have most likely stopped the threat," Haab told Fox News on Feb. 17.


Let's see how many call this student survivor, who assisted many students during the ordeal, a liar....besides CNN that is
 

apoptygma

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Dec 31, 2017
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Now the "you think you're a know-it-all" argument is one that I would concede is typical of the high school level. Thanks for the example, but get back to your homework son!

However, none of the outliers at the Town Hall went to that one.
I was right, you DO know it all.
 

Bud Plug

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I was right, you DO know it all.
Doubling down on dumb arguments, also high school level. Good second example.

Actually a couple of the participants did do this. Like the kid who kept asking Rubio to agree that he wouldn't accept donations from the NRA, even after Rubio explained why he wouldn't commit to that.
 

apoptygma

Well-known member
Dec 31, 2017
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Doubling down on dumb arguments, also high school level. Good second example.

Actually a couple of the participants did do this. Like the kid who kept asking Rubio to agree that he wouldn't accept donations from the NRA, even after Rubio explained why he wouldn't commit to that.
Yeah... heaven forbid that someone would apply pressure regarding a topic they are passionate about.
Must be their 'inexperience', huh? You would have done it completely differently, right? Just let Rubio off the hook?
 

Bud Plug

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Yeah... heaven forbid that someone would apply pressure regarding a topic they are passionate about.
Must be their 'inexperience', huh? You would have done it completely differently, right? Just let Rubio off the hook?
I would have completely accepted the questions of the Town Hall if you had written them! You should really get in touch with CNN/Dems (it doesn't matter which, it's likely the same phone number).

For the benefit of those who didn't watch the presentation, Tapper made it clear that it was a discussion, not a debate. It was a Town Hall which allowed views to be aired, and answers to be provided by politicians and the NRA. It wasn't an organized protest to demand specific actions. And it certainly wasn't supposed to be about campaign finances, no matter what anyone thinks the relationship between that issue and stopping school shootings might be.
 
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