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Woman says granddaughter wet herself after being blocked from washroom on Air Canada

Jasmine Raine

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Jul 28, 2014
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So here is the story.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/woman-...-from-washroom-on-air-canada-flight-1.3467145

An Alberta woman said Air Canada refused to let her three-year-old granddaughter use the nearest washroom on a flight from Nova Scotia to Calgary, which resulted in the toddler wetting herself and having to sit in her own urine for three hours.
“When I did go to take Ruby to use the washroom around the second or third time the flight attendant told me I couldn’t come up here anymore,” grandmother Stacey Osmond told CTV News Channel Monday.
“I was taken aback by it. I couldn’t believe it,” she said. “I didn’t know that washroom was only for business class people.”

Osmond said the agent who helped her book the flight put the couple in seats close to the washroom so her granddaughter could have quick access.
After being denied access, Osmond and Ruby went back to their seats.

A little while later, when they tried to use the rear washroom, a service cart was blocking the aisle.

“I tried to take her to the front washroom and explain to [the flight attendant] that the service cart was blocking the rear washroom and she still said no,” said Osmond.

Osmond told CTV News Channel that she stood behind the service cart for a period of time and no one offered to move it, so they once again returned to their seats.
Ruby became insistent that she needed to use the washroom.

“I didn’t want to cause a scene or have an incident with my small grandchild so Ruby ended up peeing in her pants,” she said.

While Osmond did think about pressing the issue, a passenger seated next to her scared her by saying that Air Canada could bar her from flying on the airline in the future. So she decided against it.
Osmond added that she also observed another passenger attempt to use the front bathroom due to the service cart blockage and was denied on three separate occasions.
Osmond told CTV News Channel that Ruby was stoic about the whole situation.

“She kept telling me it will be okay Nan,” said Osmond. “She was good with it.”

Osmond sent Air Canada a message the following day and they apologized and offered her a 25 per cent discount on her next flight.
But Osmond wrote back that it wasn’t enough.

Air Canada then phoned and apologized, as well as offered a $200 voucher for future flights and some toys for Ruby, Osmond said.

Osmond still isn’t satisfied. She told CTV News Channel she should have gotten an apology from the flight attendant herself.

“They can’t be behaving like this and expect someone else to clean it up for them,” she said.

Air Canada told CTV News Channel they have been in touch with Osmond about this “regrettable incident” and have no further comment on this issue.
and another take on the story - which is the original that I read

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/toddler-sat-in-pee-air-canada-grandmother-says-1.4166122

An Alberta woman says a return flight from Nova Scotia to Calgary last month went wrong after her granddaughter was prevented from using the closest washroom, leading the toddler to wet herself and sit in her own urine for about three hours.

And while Air Canada has offered to make it right, Stacey Osmond says she is looking for a personal apology from the flight attendant to prevent it from happening again.

Osmond says the agent who helped her book the flight put the couple in seats close to business class at the front of the airplane so that her granddaughter, who's almost three years old, would have quick access to a washroom.

"The second or third time I tried to take Ruby to the bathroom, the flight attendant told me, 'I can't have you coming up here anymore,'" Osmond, who lives in Okotoks just south of Calgary, told CBC News.

"I said, 'She's a baby. I was given those seats by a booking agent for that reason, so that she would be close to the bathroom.'

"She said, 'That doesn't matter, you are not to come up here.'"

Osmond says about midway through the 5½-hour flight, her granddaughter, Ruby, needed to go but a service cart blocked her access to the washroom at the rear of the plane.

Ruby couldn't hold it and wet herself, Osmond says.

"I was enraged," she said.

"I sat there, still having to play with Ruby with a smile on my face, while I was just full of anger because of this woman, especially after she peed in her pants. I got some napkins off the flight attendant and I put them underneath her so she could sit on them."

Ruby had finished potty training months earlier, so Osmond did not think to have a diaper on hand. She says she didn't have a change of clothes ready either, because she hadn't flown with a small child in about 15 years.

Once back in Calgary, Osmond says Air Canada offered her a 25 per cent discount off her next flight, a $200 voucher and some toys for Ruby, but the 44-year-old says she's looking for a full refund and she'd like to hear from the flight attendant directly.

"I'd like her to have to call and apologize and maybe she'll think twice about how she acts in the future," Osmond said.

"It was a very unpleasant flight for us."

An airline spokesperson acknowledged the incident.

"We're in contact with our customer about this regrettable incident. We have no further comment," Angela Mah wrote in an emailed response.

A Halifax-based airline passenger advocate says staff should be able to use discretion.

"Something has to change here," Gabor Lukacs said.

"Safety is very important, but where do we draw the line between restrictions for the sake of safety and insanity. It is just lack of restraint. Those powers to direct passengers are given to crew for the purpose of safety, not for the purpose of making passengers wet themselves."

Meanwhile, Osmond says her issue is with that one employee.

"I don't blame an entire airline for one flight attendant," she said. "This was the first time I experienced such hostility."
I am kind of at a loss here. I truly think this woman is a little out to lunch. At least based on the first story I read. It seems there has since been some changes to the story. Now another person was also denied, and I think this woman may have thought that would help her case, but not quite. All it shows to me is that the attendant was treating everyone equally.

My question is, when do people start taking responsibility for their own actions. How do you bring a child that young with potty issues on a plane without bringing a change of clothes. I bring a change of clothes anytime I travel in case my luggage is lost. It is like travel common sense. Not being there of course, I think maybe the attendant was doing her job, and this entitled woman is calling the attendant hostile because she was not given the answer she wanted, not because the attendant was actually HOSTILE. To be so demanding to want a full refund, and personal apology, like get real lady.

She gets to pass the buck on the diaper, and the change of clothes. All of sudden in the second story, a little after the first was published, she is now stating she feared being barred from future flights, because some other passenger said so???? And no one offered to move the cart?? Did she ask? Did she say to those attendants - "hey - 3 year old has to pee, can we get past please?"

I just have to wonder when people are going to start to be held accountable for their own short comings that lead to situations like this. Business class people pay a higher price and if that means they get to hog that washroom, then so be it. they have that right as well.

Now I know I sound mean. I get it, it was a poor 3 year old who should not have had to go through this, but I think the fault lies more with Grandma, then the attendant who was just doing their job.

Thoughts?
 

bazokajoe

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Nov 6, 2010
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I was flying with Delta once and seated in first class.I had to use the washroom and the ones in first class were occupied. I proceeded to the washrooms in coach and the stewardess stopped me and told me I had to use the ones in first class. Not a big deal.
 

Brill

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Jun 29, 2008
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A $200 voucher and toys for her child is more than enough. She should have spoke up about needing to get past the cart.
 

TeeJay

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Jun 20, 2011
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A 3 year old even after potty training is still likely to have accidents
A diaper at that age is not a major issue but at least have a change of clothes with you

They also mention "standing around" in front of cart but do not see anything about asking to move it

Her entire issue is wanting to use business/first class washrooms
Well then next time buy those tickets

These are the kinds of guardians that are not fit to look after a child
 

lul65

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May 29, 2014
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I get sick and tired of the people always trying to use business class washrooms,most of my flights are long haul and i pay for business class to be able to sleep.I do not need economy passengers going past my seat and disturbing me because they can not be bothered to walk or line up.I you want a washroom that is reserved spend the money and travel business or first,End of rant
 

oldjones

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Aug 18, 2001
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OK, I buy the right to restrict the pricey washroom for the people who bought that right. And I see that demoting the toilet-trained three-year old back to diapers is prudent, even if it's nasty all round. So let's just drop those issues and consider the other part of the story. That's about standard Economy service for standard Economy passengers. Apparently, without warning they were denied access to washrooms for an indefinite time. So Air Canada could sell drinks and chips.

"This is the Captain speaking: Beverage service is about to begin. The washrooms will be unavailable until it concludes and the carts are returned to the Galley. Line up now, or be prepared to wait 45 minutes"

Why not?
 

anon1

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Aug 19, 2001
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I get sick and tired of the people always trying to use business class washrooms,most of my flights are long haul and i pay for business class to be able to sleep.I do not need economy passengers going past my seat and disturbing me because they can not be bothered to walk or line up.I you want a washroom that is reserved spend the money and travel business or first,End of rant
Damn peasants!
 

K Douglas

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Jan 5, 2005
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Seriously the parent didn't even have a change of clothes on the plane for the kid? 3 years old is still pretty young, accidents are bound to happen.
 

explorerzip

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Jul 27, 2006
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The flight attendant allegedly said that "I can't have you coming up here anymore." This makes it sounds like the grandmother and child were allowed to use the business class washroom earlier during the flight.
 

hamermill

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What she should have done was to have the child drop her pants and pee and take a dump where the flight attendant sits. Moron flight attendant. For F sake she is 3 years old.
 

GPIDEAL

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Jun 27, 2010
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Damn peasants!
Lol. I tend to agree with OldJones, and two recent posters just above. WTF? Or the flight attendant should have interceded and helped them get to the other bathroom

As for those who ask why the guardian didn't bring a change of clothes for the 3 year old, she felt that she didn't have to, since they were seated close to the Business Class bathroom. So then I'd sue the fucking travel agent who should have warned her (lol).

BTW, would they let her change her 3 year old or even a diaper at her seat, or would she have to use a bathroom?
 

bazokajoe

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The flight attendant allegedly said that "I can't have you coming up here anymore." This makes it sounds like the grandmother and child were allowed to use the business class washroom earlier during the flight.
Most likely someone in business class complained and they have every right to.
 

Jasmine Raine

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Jul 28, 2014
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If a flight attendant, I would rather deal with someone complaining about my letting the 3 yo use the bathroom than saying NO in regards to letting that same 3 yo use that bathroom. What is a matter with some of you people?

Someone mentioned that "Nan" could have made an effort to have the service cart moved to allow for access. Could the flight attendant not have done that for her after she mentioned it or perhaps reply to the person in business class who may have complained? The flight attendant is there for service, is she not?

The different views can easily be identified as such: those who agree with the flight attendant are snooty and lack compassion, those who would have let the 3 yo use the bathroom understand the situation and have compassion.
Who said anything about not having compassion. Clearly this is slightly lost on you. This is not about flight attendant vrs 3 yr old. It can't be. The dynamics make it so it can't be. So to label people who understand that as lacking compassion, is in my opinion quite ignorant of you.

The 3 year old is the poor victim who had to suffer the consequences of the adults in the situation. So bringing this back to the adults nows, let's look at responsibility and accountability shall we.

  1. The FA is responsible for all passengers on the plane. That includes the people in business class who paid more for the seat, the 3 yr old and her grandma, the people being served the drinks and food from the cart. There are multiple FAs in this situation as I assume the one in business class was not the one with the service cart blocking the other washroom.
  2. Then we have the airline personal who booked the flight who, if we go by grandma's story, told her she can use the washroom in question.
  3. Then we have grandma who is solely responsible for the child.

You seem to say that the accountability and responsibility lies with the FA who rejected the use of the business class washroom. Since it has been reported that the FA also equally refused others from economy from using the business class washroom, this is not a case of a mean big bad FA picking on a little 3 yr old. This appears to be a FA being responsible for ALL passengers and treating all passengers the same. Since the FA's accountability to the bosses etc., the FA is fulfilling their duty in that regard. Now, since it doesn't say, if the FA was scheduled to handle the people in business class, which I suspect is the case, then that FA was doing their job completely. The washroom issue, then gets put on the FA's in the eco class section of the plane and I will add that the business class FA, I would assume, would not be paying attention to the service in eco class, and therefore would not know or be responsible to the serving cart in eco class. Which mean grandma's gripe with that specific FA and demand for public apology, just went flying out the window. But let's keep going so we can find where the buck really lands.

The eco class FA's certainly had a responsibility to the 3 yr old and and grannie in their section. They also have a responsibility to all the others as well. It would appear to me that they also were doing their job by handing out stuff from the serving cart. Since it does not say that they were being rude, not allowing people past when asked, etc. I am going to assume they were not aware that the 3 yr old was A) in need of the washroom and B) that the child was denied the business class washrooms. Without this information and because FA's can't read minds yet, they are kind of off the hook. They were also doing their job responsibly based on the knowledge they had at hand.

So we move on to the airline personal who apparently gave the seat based on proximity to the business class washroom knowing they were only booking an economy class seat. They have the responsibility to book flights according and not to give false information regarding use of plane and service. So if there is accountability on the part of the airline, it is with this employee. However, in this case we have to look at the source of said information, and that was grandma who reported this airline personal of giving her this info. I don't know if that is true or not, but if I was grandma, this is where my upset with be.

Now moving on to grandma. She had the sole responsibility to the 3 yr old. That includes everything, and while I agree, you can't control everything and you can't plan for everything, there are certain things that are just common sense when in care of a child and any one of things in this case would have resulted in a much different outcome for her grandchild.

  1. Always bring a change of clothes in your carry on. This is for more then just pant wetting. This is for lost luggage, etc.
  2. Bring a diaper, or pull up for the potty training child who will be stuck on an airplane for 5 hours.
  3. Speak up on behalf of the child to ask the FA's with serving cart to allow them past. I know you think this is not a big one but it is. The FA's are busy doing something else. They have no way of knowing that the people standing around are looking to get by them. Having been on many flights, I know FA's move and many people get by when needing the bathroom. They all use this magic word that let's people politely know they need to get past. It is called "Excuse me". If you don't speak up and think people will just read your mind, you will always be left disappointed. That is not even highlighting the very important fact that when you are in care of child, you need to advocate on behalf of that child. Grandma needed to focus her attention on advocating for the child to RIGHT people. Instead she got herself all flustered at being rightfully denied a washroom that was not for her section.

Now as I said, people can't think of everything but when we don't think of the things that are our responsibility, then we that is when we need to take accountability. Which grandma is not. She is jumping on the airline hate bandwagon, and having her moment to shine all while the 3yr old suffered. Grandma was on the one consistent in this whole thing. She admits that she has not traveled with a child in over 15 years so she just didn't think. That is where it should end. She didn't think, kid pee'd herself. Accept it and move on, but nope Grannie things that others should have picked up the ball she dropped. All to save her from being wrong and having her grandchild suffer for her mistakes.

So yes, I guess in a world where people pick up after others all the time, the business class FA could have broken the rules for grannie and let the child use the bathroom. You are right, but the FA has rules to follow as well and yes that means telling grannie to use the washroom required and holding grannie accountable for her grandchild. Now I know the second story published a day later has grannie saying the business class FA was told of the cart issue, but I am personally calling BS to that. There are a couple of things that changed in grannie's story from one article to the other. AFTER grannie had a day to process and add some new "tidbits" to make her story sound better and allow her to pass the buck, which to most normal rational and logical people, all know stops with grannie.

EOD on responsibility and accountability.

Now if you want to know what I personally would have done if I was grannie or the business class FA, I will be happy to tell you. Then maybe you can place your judgement on me and my apparent snottiness and lack of compassion. I mean I would at least wait for someone's personal take on what their actual actions would be before labeling them as one thing or another. But hey, that is just me.
 

bazokajoe

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Nov 6, 2010
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If a flight attendant, I would rather deal with someone complaining about my letting the 3 yo use the bathroom than saying NO in regards to letting that same 3 yo use that bathroom. What is a matter with some of you people?

Someone mentioned that "Nan" could have made an effort to have the service cart moved to allow for access. Could the flight attendant not have done that for her after she mentioned it or perhaps reply to the person in business class who may have complained that there is currently a service cart blocking the aisle? After all, the flight attendant is there for service is she not?

The different views can easily be identified as such: those who agree with the flight attendant are snooty and lack compassion, those who would have let the 3 yo use the bathroom understand the situation and have compassion.
Call me snooty and lacking compassion,I really don't care. Grandma fucked up,plain and simple.
 

Jasmine Raine

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Jul 28, 2014
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@Jessica Rain:
You're so lost in the basic principle that a 3 yo is not like every other passenger. TBH I didn't even read your whole post, I didn't have to.
As stated in my first post on this thread: "The world is not black and white."
The fact that you even mention that the passengers in business class paid more for their seats and therefor are (place your word(s) here about them being "better" in any way). It's like stating, thinking or believing that the wealthier people should be entitled to better Health Care. Please!!!
That you state that the FA in particular may only work in business class, as in "Sorry but that's not my department" as a type of defense... Again, please!!!

This is a case where perception can drastically vary.
Wow. So now I have said that wealthy people deserve better health care?????? Holy fuck I am horrible person. LOL. I can't believe I said that!!!! I should be taken out back and shot.

Since you could not be bothered to admittedly read what I wrote, and continue to make comments and assumptions, I will chaulk it up to my first interruption, you are just posting ignornantly. Which is your right and you don't even have to pay extra for it. Yay you!

Have a great day.
 

Jasmine Raine

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Jul 28, 2014
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I said, "It's like..." as in, "It would be similarly to..."

Wow! You're a touchy one. lol

Enjoy your day as well!

WIR
Right as in equal to believing that business class means better which I did not say either. So ....... again, ignorantly posting.

Touchy = nah. Laughing my ass off at you = ya... just a little. Sorry. :wave:
 

doggee_01

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Jul 11, 2003
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come on people! it's a 3 year old she needs to use the bathroom someone (air hostess??) should be able to do something jesus!
 

Jasmine Raine

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Jul 28, 2014
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come on people! it's a 3 year old she needs to use the bathroom someone (air hostess??) should be able to do something jesus!
Please don't mistake my argument regarding responsibility to mean I would personally do the same if I was either the grandmother or the flight attendant. As the flight attendant, I would have probably taken the child to the fanciest bathroom they had but then that is why I would never make it as a FA. I just would not be able to follow the rules. As grannie, I have already implied as to what I would do.

The question is does grannie really deserve a personal apology from the flight attendant? Does she deserve a full refund?
 
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