Actually as mentioned he did, throwing opposition leaders into prison on blatantly trumped up charges.
Must say that this isn't a very good sales pitch for State Socialist utopias that you are making.
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How well is far-left socialism working in Venezuela for you Lefties??
- Thread starter Phil C. McNasty
- Start date
Must say that this isn't a very good sales pitch for State Socialist utopias that you are making.
You know that YOU are the bourgeoisie, right? Perhaps you could do us all a favor...As I posted above, Chavez did the fundamental mistake of leaving the bourgeoisie to work with the Americans to sabotage the Government. He should have taken a page from Fidel Castro and Lenin.
After You, Sir.You know that YOU are the bourgeoisie, right? Perhaps you could do us all a favor...
I'm not against the bourgeois having all the power and money.After You, Sir.
I am.I'm not against the bourgeois having all the power and money.
But Dan, you are a man of means and you make your money from speculation, so are you not, to a large degree, part of the system?I am.
If you wanna play pure extremism, then you cannot have capitalism with government ownership of many major means of production either... so I think we can agree that there is no example of a PURE market based economy and PURE socialist economy. The ideologies exist on opposite ends of a spectrum, and my point is, most successful counties are on the left side of that spectrum and have a great deal of socialist ideas built into their systems.Sorry, you cannot have socialism without common ownership of the means of production. The fathers of Socialism would not be happy with your definition. Below is definition from one of the online dictionaries.
Sweden, Norway, Canada have common ownership over very little means of production, but they are not socialists states.
so·cial·ism
ˈsōSHəˌlizəm/Submit
noun
a political and economic theory of social organization that advocates that the means of production, distribution, and exchange should be owned or regulated by the community as a whole.
synonyms: leftism, welfarism; More
policy or practice based on the political and economic theory of socialism.
synonyms: leftism, welfarism; More
(in Marxist theory) a transitional social state between the overthrow of capitalism and the realization of communism.
Fair enough, but that is a different conversation. However, my point is that you or I cannot determine how to use the terminology, and I believe that most socialists would insist that Socialism must only representIf you wanna play pure extremism, then you cannot have capitalism with government ownership of many major means of production either... so I think we can agree that there is no example of a PURE market based economy and PURE socialist economy. The ideologies exist on opposite ends of a spectrum, and my point is, most successful counties are on the left side of that spectrum and have a great deal of socialist ideas built into their systems.
systems where production is publicly owned.
Capitalism is an economic system not a system of government. Many years ago, I did a presentation for a class I was taking, but have forgotten alot of the nuance of this argument.
There is even a term for it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_capitalism
Black markets are the purest forms of capitalism.Hong Kong and Singapore are the closest to unfettered capitalism.
Until 4 days ago, Toronto real estate was the purest form of capitalism.Black markets are the purest forms of capitalism.
If you study economic history, you will notice that in the western democratic world, every progressive step for equality and welfare has been put in place by well off, even rich people.But Dan, you are a man of means and you make your money from speculation, so are you not, to a large degree, part of the system?
The poor masses, the proletariat, does not in our system of government have any chance of effecting change.
Well maybe in France it went down differently but it is possible that was started by elites who lost control of it and then lost their heads. But yes you are right, there are many elites that see that the preservation of their wealth in the long term requires greater equity. In fact anti-trust acts in the US came from Roosevelt who was pretty damn rich....If you study economic history, you will notice that in the western democratic world, every progressive step for equality and welfare has been put in place by well off, even rich people.
The poor masses, the proletariat, does not in our system of government have any chance of effecting change.
So... our system seems to work!If you study economic history, you will notice that in the western democratic world, every progressive step for equality and welfare has been put in place by well off, even rich people.
The poor masses, the proletariat, does not in our system of government have any chance of effecting change.
You'd have trouble finding a Cuban who wouldn't rather move to Canada or the US, given the chance. That's because our bourgeoisie have done a better job managing our economy than Cuba's dictatorship has.
The reason we are able to have such generous social programs here is that our economy is based on capitalism. That provides the money it takes to pay for good social benefits. In a capitalist system there's enough wealth that the taxes provide enough revenue for these sorts of things.
You are wrong on so many levels. Here is a few of your misconceptions:So... our system seems to work!
You'd have trouble finding a Cuban who wouldn't rather move to Canada or the US, given the chance. That's because our bourgeoisie have done a better job managing our economy than Cuba's dictatorship has.
The reason we are able to have such generous social programs here is that our economy is based on capitalism. That provides the money it takes to pay for good social benefits. In a capitalist system there's enough wealth that the taxes provide enough revenue for these sorts of things.
1. Our system here in Canada does not work well. Income inequality is high, social mobility is low.
2. It is not difficult at all to find Cubans who do not want to move to the US or Canada
3. Canada does not have generous social programs.
Please move to Cuba.You are wrong on so many levels. Here is a few of your misconceptions:
1. Our system here in Canada does not work well. Income inequality is high, social mobility is low.
2. It is not difficult at all to find Cubans who do not want to move to the US or Canada
3. Canada does not have generous social programs.
Can't you just picture Danmand sitting in the Salon or fancy dining room using his Champagne glass as a pointer while discoursing on the evils of capitalism?
I would not want to be responsible for a drop in the average intelligence of Canadians.Please move to Cuba.
