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Ottawa down, Toronto next?

ottawasub

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There`s already a thread on this topic in the Ottawa section here, but it`s possible many Toronto posters might not check out that part of Terb.

https://terb.cc/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=94108

Council got their way when a judge upheld their new by-law, which was nothing but a thinly veiled attempt to drive the SCs out of business.

Summary: no more touching of any kind; no more private booths, or champagne rooms of any kind.

So is this going to inspire the municipal politicians in Toronto? Not sure what the situation is down there, but this could be a very dangerous precedent.
 

TheNiteHwk

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Believe it or not…

The story I heard from a couple of dancers is that this whole thing was started by some disgruntled dancers.

True there are those (dancers) that because of the possible income increase like the private booths and $20. dances. There are however those to that want to go back to the $10. touchless tableside dances like it was years ago. They are the ones that went to city hall and complained that they had to allow touching etc when they preferred not to. And that in part is what started the wheels rolling.
 

ottawasub

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There are however those to that want to go back to the $10. touchless tableside dances like it was years ago. They are the ones that went to city hall and complained that they had to allow touching etc when they preferred not to.
I always was under the impression that every dancer had the right to not allow touching if thet chose. Have any of the clubs specifically told girls that they must allow touching? If so, then I don`t blame the dancers for going to City Hall to complain; if not then they had nothing to be upset about.

It was $5 years ago hawk!!!!!!!!!!! Or at least when I started visiting the clubs.
Whenever I see the movie Exotica, every time they mention $5 dances i think "That`s really dated!"; then I remember it was only 10 years ago.
 

Mudd Stuffin

Active member
As long as the majority of girls are happy to cut their income in half, I'm sure this will become a law in no-time.... :rolleyes:

But seriously, the folks in Ottawa probably didn't want the MPs being caught with their pants down, so I'm sure the Ottawa city council was encouraged to pass this law.
 

Keebler Elf

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It's when the dancers start complaining that the shit really starts to hit the fan. Remember that disgruntled dancer from Toronto that created the shitstorm a while back? I think she wrote a book or something and the Star had a field day with her.

However, I don't think Ottawa has the numbers of immigrant dancers that TO does. And they're not complaining about the money they're making.
 

CLOUD 500

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Jan 10, 2005
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hmmm... $10 table dances? what is the point of that if there is no bump and grind. i would not pay any amount of money for table dances. the way i see it i go in and i see the girl on stage is enough. the $20 lapdances makes it worthwhile to spend some money. if this goes down then there is no point to go to stripclubs.
 

canucklehead

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Sheik said:
It was $5 years ago hawk!!!!!!!!!!! Or at least when I started visiting the clubs.
Funny thing is i looked at how much i was spending and how often i went and i spent back in the 5 dollar day and i spent more and went more often.
10 dollars in todays market and time is cheap......... though i did fill up gas t 98 cents a litre at coxwell and oconnor last night around 1 am on my way home.
 

TheNiteHwk

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ottawasub said:
I always was under the impression that every dancer had the right to not allow touching if thet chose. Have any of the clubs specifically told girls that they must allow touching? If so, then I don`t blame the dancers for going to City Hall to complain; if not then they had nothing to be upset about.
During my last trip to Ottawa I was discussing this with a couple of dancers I knew very well from years ago at The Fax. They were explaining to me that some of them felt that they had no choice but to allow some limited touching because of how many other dancers that were allowing it and if they did not then they would have no business. Sadly some dancers are in a way stuck in the industry and have no other means of support or the ability to get out. For them the pressure is even greater to give in and allow touching or if not then accept a very huge income loss that they would not be able to bare. Some of these dancers had at that time gone to great lengths to let their viewpoint be known... including a couple that went to the press and to city hall.

Sheik said:
It was $5 years ago hawk!!!!!!!!!!! Or at least when I started visiting the clubs.
Ah yes the good old days. When I first started out going to SCs it was $5. for tableside dances. Then when I moved to Ottawa in '91 I stopped going for a couple of years. By the time I started again it was still $5. on the floor but you had the option now of $10 dances in the CR. On my last visit to Ottawa they now do not have any tableside dancing any more. You had to go to the CR but you had a choice of $10. or $20. dances.
 

fozzy

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ottawasub said:
I always was under the impression that every dancer had the right to not allow touching if thet chose.
... and, if other girls in the area permit touching, that translates into the right to go home with no cash.

ottawasub said:
Have any of the clubs specifically told girls that they must allow touching?
Given the above, do they have to?

I'm tempted to cheer Ottawa and hope the same for Toronto... if you want someone to shake hands with Mr. Happy, go to a rub & tug and leave the bars for entertainment. I know it won't ever be like it was 10-15 years ago, but maybe we'll lose all them ugly cows that are only there because they make a buck letting people cram both hands in and maybe even, after a decade or so, we might see more dancers like I miss, the ones who are good looking and not afraid to show their bodies off but would not consider working in an SC today because they refuse to be groped.
 

2cent

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Mudd Stuffin said:
As long as the majority of girls are happy to cut their income in half, I'm sure this will become a law in no-time....
Making a quarter of what they used to make is more like it. We've been spoiled rotten all these years. If the old no touch dances are back, I don't think the majority of us would bother to pay for the private dances. We'll just watch the stage shows. But....if it comes to that, probably the dancers won't take anything off on stage :rolleyes:
 

Keebler Elf

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Nothing will change in the SCs unless they also do something about MPs. Increasing restrictions in SCs will drive the clubs into an even worse financial position, as there will be an even stronger reason to substitute MPs for SCs.
 

cyrus

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CLOUD 500 said:
hmmm... $10 table dances? what is the point of that if there is no bump and grind. i would not pay any amount of money for table dances. the way i see it i go in and i see the girl on stage is enough. the $20 lapdances makes it worthwhile to spend some money. if this goes down then there is no point to go to stripclubs.
That is the way it was for me too back then as I don't recall buying even a single table dance at $5. For me the idea was to go and see a naked dancer on the stage, have a beer or two and head home until the next time, whenever that might be probably not sooner than a month or a year later! The $10 lap dance was what got me hooked on SC
 

Dead2Parrot

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$5 dances

I remember the old $5 dances. Absolutely, no touching, girls danced on boxes. VIP rooms for $10, couldn't tell any difference in dances just location. $20 lap dances. Then $20 became norm no matter what dance you got.
 

ottawasub

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TheNiteHwk said:
During my last trip to Ottawa I was discussing this with a couple of dancers I knew very well from years ago at The Fax. They were explaining to me that some of them felt that they had no choice but to allow some limited touching because of how many other dancers that were allowing it and if they did not then they would have no business. Sadly some dancers are in a way stuck in the industry and have no other means of support or the ability to get out. For them the pressure is even greater to give in and allow touching or if not then accept a very huge income loss that they would not be able to bare. Some of these dancers had at that time gone to great lengths to let their viewpoint be known... including a couple that went to the press and to city hall.
I don`t want to mention any names on the board, but I`m positive I know at least one of the Fax girls you`re talking about. I used to be friends with her years ago and she was extremely upset when touching started that management was allowing it.

On my last visit to Ottawa they now do not have any tableside dancing any more. You had to go to the CR but you had a choice of $10. or $20. dances.
I don`t know how long ago that visit was, but as far I know the $10 option has been gone for a long time. When it started, most of the dancers gave you the two choices, but eventually it became $20 no matter what; which sucked for the guys like me who were never comfortable touching. One dancer even told me mid-dance "You might as well grab my boobs, cuz it`ll cost you the same even if you don`t".

Some of the girls who were against touching started their own 10/20 option. The up-close dances that used to be $10 were now $20 while dancing in front of you but keeping about 3 feet away was a $10. That idea didn`t last long. Those girls eventually gave in or gave up.

I honestly think most of the girls are glad touching is over. At last year`s City Hall protest, the strippers seemed most upset about the proposal that they would all have to purchase licenses and the closing of the CRs. While the license issue was later dropped by the City, they wouldn`t back down on the CRs, which will hurt the girls more than anything else.
 

AA_date

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if u knew i'd have to kill you
there definately is a market for the $5 box dances with no touching but it's pretty obvious that customers are drawn more to the $20 higher milage.
a true test of a market is when there is little (or no) gov intervention. with out gov regulation you would see an even stronger push towards towards the $20 dances. it'll be interesting to see how ottawa attempts to put pandora back inside the box.
 

CLOUD 500

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cyrus said:
That is the way it was for me too back then as I don't recall buying even a single table dance at $5. For me the idea was to go and see a naked dancer on the stage, have a beer or two and head home until the next time, whenever that might be probably not sooner than a month or a year later! The $10 lap dance was what got me hooked on SC
i agree with that. never really went to stripclubs until the lapdances came into effect. before i would come once in a while and see some naked girls. when lapdancing came, i got hooked and am always in stripclubs spending lots of money. ottawa may want to push this but i doubt it would happen in toronto. the clubs would loose so much money and the girls will either have to work in mps or as sps outside of the club. on another note what is with ontario girls with touching? everywhere in quebec is a contact dance and no one is making any issue of it here? wounder what the big fuss is in ottawa?
 
G

GlavaMan

Actually, many of the clubs in downtown Montreal are non-contact $10 dances. It's the clubs on the outskirts & just off the island that are FS/contact. Ironically, most of the city councillor's speaking out against SC dances here in Ottawa, don't have a SC in their riding! They just want to control enough of what goes on so that nobody will want to go. It may not have even been necessary as SC's seem to be less busy most of the time & there are many more MP's than there used to be.
 

L'Chaim

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Keebler Elf said:
Remember that disgruntled dancer from Toronto that created the shitstorm a while back? I think she wrote a book or something and the Star had a field day with her.
I think her name (at least as published in the Star) was something Goldberg. I know her from her days dancing at Filmore's as Gemini. She was also the first girl from a Toronto SC that I had take-out from. How hypocritical is that?
 

fozzy

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Jun 16, 2003
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L'Chaim said:
I think her name (at least as published in the Star) was something Goldberg. I know her from her days dancing at Filmore's as Gemini. She was also the first girl from a Toronto SC that I had take-out from. How hypocritical is that?
Katherine Goldberg, wasn't it?

And wasn't Jack Layton involved in her cause?

But it ain't hypocritical in my eyes, just as it wouldn't be hypocritical for an escort you picked up at Tim Horton's to want to keep the coffee shop sex-free. <grin>
 

wumpscut

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Goldberg was trying to say she was all concerned about public health and dancer safety.... then blows/fucks someone for cash but at home instead of the club, seems VERY hypocritical to me.
 
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