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For Kathleen......re:'Playing through injury'.

Tiger Williams

Lemming like devotion....
Feb 27, 2004
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Kathleen said:
Is it me, or are more players being pussies? Where is the heart? You can come down on me for having no feeling, saying lets see me try it. But I have more respect for guys like Joe Thorton playing hurt or sore then say Sundin, or Renberg being day to day and saying.. "just a little more time", as they sip a cocktail in a jacuzzi, and drive the ol beater Porsche home.
Fine, I know they are in rehab, but what good was Mats in GM7 doing rehab? If he can practice hard, I'm sure he could sit on the bench, rally the guys, and play odd shifts like PPs.
Kathleen
Omigawd Kathleen, where do I start? That has to be one of the most ridiculously stupid posts I have seen on this board.
I took you to task last week when you referred to McCabe as a whiner. In the past I seem to recall you being critical of Tucker's act on the ice as well, not to mention Domi, Antropov, etc. etc.
And let me get this right. You claim to be a Leaf fan?!? (the idea is to support your team my dear)
Being in the Leaf Nation happens when others deem you worthy because of your support and your loyalty, not when you yourself unjustifiably think you're a member. Buying a sweater or putting a flag on your car just doesn't cut it, hon.
First of all as n_v correctly pointed out, Thornton did dick-all in the Habs series and actually hurt as opposed to helped his team by being in the lineup. To take a roster spot away from an able bodied teammate when you are hurt and unable to contribute is not only stupid it is selfish to boot.
And to infer Sundin lacks heart and then include that snide little snippet about Mats 'sipping a cocktail in the jacuzzi and then driving his Porsche home' was classless and unfair to say the least. He's a solid character guy and has proven in the past that he'll play through extreme pain, and like Nolan wants nothing more than to get better and return to the lineup and help the team. You should be ashamed of yourself for those cheapshots. With posts like that you paint a picture of yourself as someone who sits back and puts the players down, but when they win you want to march in the parade and say they're 'my team'. Does the term 'fairweather fan' ring a bell?
I've been to Lakeshore arena and watched 2 practises since Mats has been hurt and I can assure you he was not 'practising hard'. If you had followed the Leafs closely over the past few years you would know that Sundin has traditionally returned from his injuries ahead of schedule. He is not a trifler. He'll be back sooner rather than later.
 

galt

Ovature, light the lights
Nov 13, 2003
375
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yikes...a little on the harsh side....since when is questioning wrong?

Did I agree with Kat's view on things here? No, but I don't doubt for a moment she's a true fan. I've been a Leaf fan my entire life but it doesn't mean that I blindly follow them or don't question some of their decisions.

Why keep Kaberle on the blueline...why not make him a forward?
Why keep Antropov at all why not just release him outright or send him to St Johns where he can do no harm?

There are fans that agree with everything a team does. They are the ones that say every other team sucks. They are the ones with no credibility. Questioning things is one of the first ways to improvement.

To Be realistic, we all know that as fans we have little or know influence on the decisions of Quinn and JFJ but it does not take away our right to question.

Part of supporting a team (or supporting anything) is addressing the shortcomings and weekensses. Fact of the matter is McCabe is a whiner. Everytime he gets a penalty he's yelling and screaming that he didn't do it. Don't get me wrong, I like McCabe. I feel much more comfortable when he is on the ice than when Berg or Kaberle are but he reminds me of Dave Schultz whenever he's off to the box.

Tucker used to be a little over the top but has learned his lesson. Antopov is just as useless as tits on a bull. Point being Leafs have some very talented individuals and, collectively, more heart and grit than probably any other team in the league but they do have a couple of divas there (Nolan and Sundin are not divas I believe they would be playing if they could)

By the way, who made you Minister of Customs and Imigration for the Leaf Nation? Who decided you get to define the criteria for a Leaf fan? Because an individual doesn't have a shrine to the Leafs in their basement or attend practices or won't mortgage their house for tickets, or wears a suit to a game does not make them less of a leaf fan than anybody else.

I would actually hazard to say that a fan that is able to provide some honest critique and veiw a team objectively and, despite their teams short comings, still remain a fan is probably more appreciative of their team.

I guess that you may say one that loves something despite the imperfections is far more sincere than those that are blind to the imperfections
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
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Yeah, take it easy Tiger. People are allowed to question whatever they like - sorta the point in here, no?
 

Tiger Williams

Lemming like devotion....
Feb 27, 2004
172
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Okay galt.........I guess we'll have to take this one point at a time.

galt said:
yikes...a little on the harsh side....since when is questioning wrong?
Never. And if you read my post a little (or lot) closer you would realize that not once did I say that it was.
galt said:
To Be realistic, we all know that as fans we have little or know influence on the decisions of Quinn and JFJ but it does not take away our right to question.
Again.....see above.

galt said:
I would actually hazard to say that a fan that is able to provide some honest critique and veiw a team objectively and, despite their teams short comings, still remain a fan is probably more appreciative of their team.
Geez.......again galt. See above.
(and calling a guy that gives his heart and soul to the team that you love 'a whiner' is hardly what I would call 'honest critique'.)

Originally posted by galt
Nolan and Sundin are not divas I believe they would be playing if they could
Bingo! And that was the premise of my post. Kathleen crossed the line in my book when she inferred that Mats was laming out with his injury. Based on his history with this team I believe he deserves more respect than that. He goes all out with the rehab and has always returned before the expected date. This point was made yet again tonight when he came back for game two of the Flyers series after newspaper and radio reports today had him missing the entire series.

Originally posted by galt
By the way, who made you Minister of Customs and Imigration for the Leaf Nation? Who decided you get to define the criteria for a Leaf fan?
Fan: (short for fanatic) an ardent devotee; an enthusiast.

(True fans in the Leaf Nation don't put their team down or infer their teams' captain lacks heart when he has clearly displayed behaviour to the contrary.)
Ask one next time you see one.
 

Tiger Williams

Lemming like devotion....
Feb 27, 2004
172
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Ranger68 said:
Yeah, take it easy Tiger. People are allowed to question whatever they like - sorta the point in here, no?
Geez Ranger.........not you too.
See above buddy.
 

Tiger Williams

Lemming like devotion....
Feb 27, 2004
172
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Mudd Stuffin said:
I agree that if Renberg breaks a finger-nail that he takes a week off, but who cares - he's about as good as Jonus Hoglund.

As for Mats, I feel and know what he is going through. I am a hack playing rec league hockey and this year I had a very similar sounding injury (as what they reported it to be in the Globe & Mail). This is painful, you can get about a few good shifts in, but with the slightest bit of body contact to that area (or surrounding body parts), you are in serious pain & effectively useless. The slightest wrong step, and there it goes again. If you feel Mats should play under those conditions; take away a roster spot from someone who is 100% healthy and eager; I think you are wrong & don't have a clue.

We all say how brutal Joe Thornton was in the Montreal series. He should have waited it out, not plated the first 4 or 5 games, then come back as healthy as possible. Because of that we now have to endure all those annoying Habs fans.
Now this guy gets it!
 

Tiger Williams

Lemming like devotion....
Feb 27, 2004
172
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Kathleen said:
Ever see the movie "The Fan"? I wonder if your taking your role of Leaf Nation, too serious.
Yeah I did see the "The Fan" Kathleen. But you are the one upset with the players, hon, not I. Maybe Mats and Darcy should be wary of a certain female stalking them ala DeNiro at the next Leafs' luncheon. LOL

Kathleen said:
Don't question my loyalty to the Leafs, first, you don't know me enough to comment who I am and where I stand. But I can assure you, It's not that deep.
Okay.......you admit your loyalty is not that deep. Fine. That explains a few things.

Kathleen said:
I'm inbetween. I follow the team from Oct to elimination. I've enjoyed the company of leafs at private functions too, and greatly enjoyed such a pleasure.
And you repay this pleasure by calling them 'whiners' etc.?

Kathleen said:
Sipping a cocktail was a joke, I even said so.. I was just upset at losing game six.
I just re-read your post again and I can't see the part where you said 'sipping a cocktail etc.' was a joke.

Kathleen said:
Again, your entitled to opinions, so am I. Don't be too harsh, just because you are more hardcore then I am.
Having a passion for the same team should make us friends, lets not split hairs.
I didn't mean to be harsh Kathleen but that inference about Mats lacking heart and milking his injury got my blood up. He's been a class act and a great captain and player for the Leafs and he doesn't deserve to be unjustly criticized like that.

Kathleen [/B][/QUOTE]
 

galt

Ovature, light the lights
Nov 13, 2003
375
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Ok tiger you win. You're very special and you should be proud. Your lemming like devotion and lack of independent thought must make you the best leaf fan on earth. I am humbled by your presence on this board. I am incredibly embarrassed that I ever had the gaul to doubt the leafs in any way shape or form. The brightness of you're devotion blinds me and warms me to the heart of my being. The logic of your arguements would baffle even socrates. Boy you really took me to task I'll tell you. Your ability to slice an arguement into little pieces and selectively remove things and take things out of context is overwhelming. I must say you are the king. You are the man. Wow am I ever impressed.
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
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Tiger Williams said:
Geez Ranger.........not you too.
See above buddy.
To call Kathleen's post "one of the most ridiculously stupid posts" you've ever seen on this board ...... well, I guess you haven't read too many posts on this board.

Geez, Tiger, my post was agreeing that you were a bit harsh. Perhaps, if you disagree with someone - someone who's at least *trying* to make intelligent commentary, someone who hasn't attacked you - maybe you should just pull back on the vitiriol next time.

Okay buddy?
 

Tiger Williams

Lemming like devotion....
Feb 27, 2004
172
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galt said:
Ok tiger you win. You're very special and you should be proud.
Thanks galt!
galt said:
Your lemming like devotion and lack of independent thought must make you the best leaf fan on earth.
I'd never make that claim. There's plenty of us. Just look for people that love and support their team without bitching all the time.
galt said:
I am humbled by your presence on this board. I am incredibly embarrassed that I ever had the gaul to doubt the leafs in any way shape or form.
You're way too hard on yourself galt buddy.
galt said:
The brightness of you're devotion blinds me and warms me to the heart of my being.
Get a pair of Ray Bans...........but I'm glad you're cozy.
galt said:
The logic of your arguements would baffle even socrates.
You're giving me way too much credit.
galt said:
Boy you really took me to task I'll tell you.
Nah.........you got off easy! LOL
galt said:
Your ability to slice an arguement into little pieces and selectively remove things and take things out of context is overwhelming.
Thanks again. (I think. LOL)
galt said:
I must say you are the king. You are the man. Wow am I ever impressed.
Appreciate the kind words but Borje Salming was the king.
Wendel was the man.
 

Tiger Williams

Lemming like devotion....
Feb 27, 2004
172
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Ranger68 said:
To call Kathleen's post "one of the most ridiculously stupid posts" you've ever seen on this board ...... well, I guess you haven't read too many posts on this board.
Geez, Tiger, my post was agreeing that you were a bit harsh. Perhaps, if you disagree with someone - someone who's at least *trying* to make intelligent commentary, someone who hasn't attacked you - maybe you should just pull back on the vitiriol next time.
Okay buddy?
I explained to Kathleen how I felt she crossed the line with the cheap shot at Sundin. It wasn't my intention to be harsh. Certainly didn't mean to be vitriolic.
But inferring that Mats lacks heart and was milking his injury is totally unfair and uncalled for.
(It's always been my nature to defend those that aren't able to defend themselves. LOL)
 

blitz

New member
Nov 25, 2003
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Toronto
please don't dis sundin

ya dis sundin, ya dis the leafs

ya don't know that, ya don't know nothing

ps.
belak will never be the answer
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
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Belak?
Who said Belak would be the answer??
Actually, I recall saying that Belak would be a positive move - inserting him and perhaps sitting Kaberle.
You put enough positive moves together and, guess what - you HAVE the answer.
 

Jim Rome

Banned
Aug 9, 2003
568
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Ranger68 said:
Belak?
Who said Belak would be the answer??
Actually, I recall saying that Belak would be a positive move - inserting him and perhaps sitting Kaberle.
Ranger,
Are you playing through a serious head injury ?
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
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Pansey asking ME if I've got a serious head injury?!
ROTFLMFAO
I really should take the nimrod off Ignore - he can certainly come out with some lines that really make my day.
:D
LOL
 

Ranger68

New member
Mar 17, 2003
3,665
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Of course, he can't quite grasp the whole "Ignore List" concept.
LOL
 

Jim Rome

Banned
Aug 9, 2003
568
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0
Yeah, I'm 3 inches Goldenboy, but width isn't everything ... hehehe .... so talk to any dancers lately or still working on it ? - "I still don't understand why she snobs me. " - too funny !!

________________________________________________
Favourite quote on TERB:
Goldenboy:
"Many of the other dancers have introduced themselves and actually talk, but for some reason Keri ignores me. For that reason, I don't like her too much. She IS cute, but I still don't understand why she snobs me. I'm a young guy and very approachable but it looks like I might have to be the one to initiate a conversation with her next time i'm in. ."

"There are others that are focuses on your $$$, and no matter intimate or how close you think you are with an SP, they will NEVER get together with you unless they see the $$$. I need a calculator to count those kinds of SPs."
 

Jim Rome

Banned
Aug 9, 2003
568
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Hey, Goldenboy, the fact I've done well seems to bother you. Deal with it Bro.
________________________________________________
Favourite quote on TERB:
Goldenboy:
"Many of the other dancers have introduced themselves and actually talk, but for some reason Keri ignores me. For that reason, I don't like her too much. She IS cute, but I still don't understand why she snobs me. I'm a young guy and very approachable but it looks like I might have to be the one to initiate a conversation with her next time i'm in. ."

"There are others that are focuses on your $$$, and no matter intimate or how close you think you are with an SP, they will NEVER get together with you unless they see the $$$. I need a calculator to count those kinds of SPs."
 
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