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state lotteries used for payouts??

Alexis_2

**Alexis**
I don't know why this surprises me but it does. It also really pisses me off and makes me wonder how far this type of manipulation extends.

Excerpt from a book I'm reading ... a US Marshal is leaning on a wise guy

"....

"Whoever's the first to provide information that connects to the Romeros is going to win a free Get Out of Jail pass as well as the daily number." Larson wasn't being facetious. State lotteries had been used for years to pay off informants. Ten thousand here, five thousand there - a low-level winning ticket in hand for all to see so there were no questions asked about where the money came from. ..."
 

Alexis_2

**Alexis**
Hurricane Hank said:
It's in the USA. Here, we just allow the convenience store owners to cheat their way to riches.
But ... do we know it can't or won't happen here? I was once told that in the half hour after lotto machines close but before draws take place, the balls with the numbers that are most played are weighted down (this from an OLG employee).

If that's the case, then they could easily produce whatever winning number they wanted. I've often wondered too if this so-called "weighting process" is used to produce no winners, leading to the mega 649 and Super 7 draws we've had.
 

Alexis_2

**Alexis**
OK - let me clarify ...

rubmeister100 said:
Maybe a friend of a friend's cousin's uncle at the barbershop?

I call bullshit.
It was my sister who told me, about nine years ago. She stated that it was a friend who worked at OLG who told it to her. I had no reason to believe my sister was BSing me. And, I brought it up only because it came to mind when I wondered how lotteries could be rigged, after reading the bit that I quoted in my original post.

Fred Zed said:
All the balls are indeed weighed before the draw, you can verify that with OLG - but not according to the formula suggested by Alexis_2.
Fred, I went looking for that information at OLG.ca but couldn't find it on their site. A general Google search produced some interesting reading ... but it was all quite dated.

The most up-to-date info I could find concerning policies and procedures were details of all the recent audits, Ombudsman's investigation, etc. but they deal primarily with the fraud issues at the level of the retailer.

This article, Lotto Ball Testing No Child's Play , describes some rigorous testing procedures but it's from 1996. And there were many articles containing information similar to this one: How Are Lottery Numbers Drawn? They might have been enough to convince me it's all BS but for the day and age we live in and bullet points like this:
"Representatives from an independent auditing firm are supposed to audit every aspect of the draw to ensure its integrity."

If the final checkpoint in the system remains human oversight, I remain, at the very least, suspicious. :eek:
 

Hurricane Hank

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May 21, 2008
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The OLG employs thousands of people. What was this guys position? "In charge of Balls Guy"?

Urban myth my friend.
 

key26

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Apr 4, 2008
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rubmeister100 said:
Agreed Fred.

There would be too many co-conspirators required to pull off a ball rigging fix and with counterproductive motivation. That means that OLG staff would be putting their jobs at risk specifically to rig the lotteries so that there would be better jackpots?

OLG staff and management are nothing if not lazy incompetents.
gee kinda like the scam and downfall of $trillions of the recent madoff, banks aig car companies - who would thought well educated high ranking people and accountants would let that happen ?
 

SilentLeviathan

I am better than you.
Oct 30, 2002
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key26 said:
gee kinda like the scam and downfall of $trillions of the recent madoff, banks aig car companies - who would thought well educated high ranking people and accountants would let that happen ?
Those aren't really comperable. With Madoff et al. you had a small group of people that were being allowed to, more or less, self regulate. The OLG is a huge government regulated organization that has tasks and responsiblities spread out over many people to prevent this from happening. Is it possible? Of course it's possible, almost anything is. What we should be asking is "Is it probable?" The answer is no. The amount of effort, coordination, communication, and just the sheer number of people involved make it next to impossible to do which is the point.
 

SilentLeviathan

I am better than you.
Oct 30, 2002
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Alexis_2 said:
I don't know why this surprises me but it does. It also really pisses me off and makes me wonder how far this type of manipulation extends.

Excerpt from a book I'm reading ... a US Marshal is leaning on a wise guy
What is the book?
 

Alexis_2

**Alexis**
Hurricane Hank said:
The OLG employs thousands of people. What was this guys position? "In charge of Balls Guy"?

Urban myth my friend.
I don't know what her position was there. And yep, I would be much happier to believe it is urban myth.

SilentLeviathan said:
What is the book?
The book is just a crime fiction novel, however, it's by a well respected author, Ridley Pearson and published by Hyperion, equally respectable.

I know it's easy to say it's all fiction but credible writers don't include such statements, even in a work of fiction, unless they have credible sources for the material. Likewise, any editor worth their salary, would flag such a statement and question its validity, only allowing it to remain if he/she was also satisfied of its credibility.

I like my little lottery ticket fix as much as the next guy and I doubt it would stop me from playing ... but I also doubt I'll ever shake the mistrust I have of the system.
 

key26

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Apr 4, 2008
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SilentLeviathan said:
Those aren't really comperable. With Madoff et al. you had a small group of people that were being allowed to, more or less, self regulate. The OLG is a huge government regulated organization that has tasks and responsiblities spread out over many people to prevent this from happening. Is it possible? Of course it's possible, almost anything is. What we should be asking is "Is it probable?" The answer is no. The amount of effort, coordination, communication, and just the sheer number of people involved make it next to impossible to do which is the point.
I'd argue that AIG has many more employees and checks and balances than the OLG has, but yet they squandered trillions $ + they managed to give themselves bonuses with gov't taxpayers bailout money - pretty clever of those devils even under gov't scrutiny !
 

Fred Zed

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UP ABOVE SMILING
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Fred, I went looking for that information at OLG.ca but couldn't find it on their site. A general Google search produced some interesting reading ... but it was all quite dated.

My info is based on an email someone I know received
from OLG.ca. Actually, if you call or email OLG
I am sure they will be happy to explain their procedures.

http://www.lotterybuddy.com/draw.htm
I think the reason lottery results may appear to be rigged is that
sometimes people don't fully understand the odds of winning.

Lotto Machine
http://www.ryo-catteau.com/boules.html

http://www.ryo-catteau.com/loto.html
 
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suburbanhobbyist

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Alexis_2 said:
If the final checkpoint in the system remains human oversight, I remain, at the very least, suspicious. :eek:
Alexis,

If you're still suspicious, you could hire some guys with fuzzy hair and sloped foreheads do a study on historical lottery results. It's possible to determine whether number biases are statistically significant. I think that there are even lottery results posted on this board to get you started.
 
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